322 Tiburon Installation

[Newell Nut]

X2 on your comments and yes I believe the reel is weaker when you leave the inner ring screws out. They were designed in there for a reason.

I just installed a green frame on my wife's S332 to match her reel seat and diamond wraps. As I installed I just wondered anybody would expect the Tiburon frame to make a reel stronger when you leave 8 screws out of the inner ring. I just don't understand that logic unless someone just got a Tiburon frame because it looks cool.

[Newell Nut]

I had mentioned that I use wavy washers between the star and the 3-18 and this is it.
http://www.mcmaster.com/#9714k32/=win7cs

[speedwagon2]

Newell Nut,
   My 322 and 332 both have Tiburon frames with out the inside screws thru the inner ring installed.  I guess I am running durability a test on these two reels. The 322  handled a couple of schoolie YTFs over 40 lbs last season.  This years tear down, clean lube, etc did not show any obvious signs of the reel trying to twist or change alignment.  After catching one of those fish, I tested the drag(cold) to see what it was at after adjusting it during the fight. It was at 24 lbs.  Both reels have Bryan's 5+1 drags, and have tested around 30 lbs of drag cranked down hard. The 332 has not fished yet. You have a lot more time fishing and repairing Newell's then me, but looking at the design I believe the short inside screws are lot more important when the original posts and base are used because of the multiple frame pieces that have to be kept square to the side plates.  The one piece Tib frame is much stiffer then the original posts and base and has a large increase in surface area against the rings and side plates.  If there is a weak point, it will be the number and strength of the screws that pass thru the side plates and hold everything in alignment.  If I am wrong, there will be a full forensic report and pictures.  I may install the inside screws next time I have the reels apart; probably next spring. The best thing would be that I catch some bigger tuna this season and really test the reels!!  I blew up a stock long beach a few years ago by over fishing the poor thing.  It twisted and pushed the spool thru the left side.  The experiment will continue.
   Thanks for your imput.  Speedwagon2

[Tunacious]

What was your reason for leaving the inner ring screws out?

[speedwagon2]

Tunacious,
    1. The huge increase in surface, or contact area between the Tiburon frame and side plates vs the lack of contact area between the original base, frames sections, and the side plates.
    2. Carl Newell's original kits for the Penn reels had bars and base plates that were a large increase in surface area over the posts that Penn used at the time. The surface area of the frames against the side plate combined with the screws made the Penn reels with Newell kits much more resistant to twisting which is what happens the drag is loaded up and Mr Big Fish is headed south.
    3. Tiburon did not send any short screws for the inner SS rings with either of the 300 series frames I bought.
    4. I don't have a lot of experience rebuilding/modifying fishing reels.  I do have a lot of general engineering experience including modifying motorcycle frames for racing, structural inspection in the construction industry and general tinkering with mechanical devices all my life.
    5. Based on what I have learned from NN and other people on this site regarding Newell reels, I believe they are the most durable and corrosion resistant reels made.  Combined with a Tiburon frame I believe they are strongest reasonably light weight reel made. I have several aluminum lever drags.  I don't use them that much.  A forged aluminum lever drag reel maybe stronger, but with a huge weight and cost penalty.  Before answering your post,  I asked the same question to Tiburon to see what they think.  I cut and pasted the e-mail below. As I stated in my last post, this is an on going experiment.  If I blow up one of my 300 series Newell reels, I will change my mind real fast.  I did not throw those short screws out.
     
Dave Babcock(AKA Speedwagon2)   


    Hi Dave,  I believe you are correct.

  Bob



-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject:    Newell 200 and 300 series reels with Tiburon frames
Date:    Wed, 1 Apr 2015 19:02:38 +0000
From:    Babcock David <dbabcock@san.org>

To:    info@tiburonengineering.com <info@tiburonengineering.com>




Sir,
    The original 200 and 300 series newell reels used short screws that secured the inner SS ring to the frame and base sections.  They used longer screws that went thru the side plates and both the inner and outer SS rings into the frame and base pieces.  When installing a Tiburon frame in these reels, are the short inner screws needed?  It seems to me that the longer screws that go thru the side plates and both rings are sufficient.
  Thanks,  Dave Babcock


 

[Newell Nut]

I have one question. Why do think Tiburon went to the trouble of drilling and tapping the holes for the short fillister head screws if they were not needed?

[Alto Mare]

I have some Accurate frames for the Jigmaster that are loaded with holes, drilled and tapped every 1/4".

[Tunacious]

Speedwagon2:

Interesting response from Tiburon. I know that Tib doesn't include the small inner screws with their kits but it never occurred to me to not use the original Newell inner screws, especially when Tib had cut the holes in their frames for the inner screws. You don't lose anything for using two more screws on the inner ring. If anything, it just becomes more bulletproof. I was a Business major so I can't speak to the engineering process. You may be absolutely correct in your engineering assessment. It sounds like you've already caught a 40# yft without any issues. Hopefully, you won't experience any failures.

[speedwagon2]

Everybody,
   The answer from "Bob" at Tiburon was interesting because I don't know if he is in the engineering department, or just some guy who answers the e-mails in the front office. This discussion has got me thinking that the next time I have the reels apart I will put the short screws in.  I built the 332(a narrowed 338) to have more line capacity then the 322 because of my experience with the fish I referenced. That fish would not have made it to the fish box if I was fishing on a sport boat. My partner was backing my boat down after the fish in sloppy conditions to keep from running out of line.  As to the holes in the Tiburon frame for the short screws, they may cross over to some of the Penn reels because both the Tiburon frames I have in my 300 series Newell reels are also used in various Penn reels. Somebody with Penn/Tiburon frame experience can answer that question.
  Speedwagon2
   

[BonitaBch]

Enjoy the spool.

Thought that I would show the final product which really turned out nice, the spool really sets it off

I had a lot of help from Paul Berinson on this, check him out at http://berinsontackle.com/  he has some original / hard-to-find stuff.

[Tunacious]

Everybody,
  The answer from "Bob" at Tiburon was interesting because I don't know if he is in the engineering department, or just some guy who answers the e-mails in the front office. This discussion has got me thinking that the next time I have the reels apart I will put the short screws in.  I built the 332(a narrowed 338) to have more line capacity then the 322 because of my experience with the fish I referenced. That fish would not have made it to the fish box if I was fishing on a sport boat. My partner was backing my boat down after the fish in sloppy conditions to keep from running out of line.  As to the holes in the Tiburon frame for the short screws, they may cross over to some of the Penn reels because both the Tiburon frames I have in my 300 series Newell reels are also used in various Penn reels. Somebody with Penn/Tiburon frame experience can answer that question.
 Speedwagon2
   

Yes...the 322/332/338 Tib frames also fit other Penn reels....see Tib list - P20/21/29. http://www.tiburonengineering.com/products/frames

Having said that, I still use the inner Newell screws on my Tib frames. Use the two outer screws as described in this post to align the inner screws and you're set.

[Shark Hunter]

That reel looks Awesome Bonita!

[fIsHsTiiCkS]

Bonita, that is a GORGEOUS reel, where did you get that spool?

[BonitaBch]

Thanks guys 

Bonita, that is a GORGEOUS reel, where did you get that spool?

Check the first post in the thread .... and I think that you may be able to source from Tiburon.

[Newell Nut]

Bonita, that is a GORGEOUS reel, where did you get that spool?

Lots of history with that spool.