alan tani @ alantani.com fishing reel repair rebuild tutorial Cleaning Accurate Anti-reverse bearings
Reel Repair by Alan Tani
July 04, 2020, 12:27:01 PM *
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Author Topic: Cleaning Accurate Anti-reverse bearings  (Read 39538 times)
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Gfish
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« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2020, 10:45:20 AM »

Cool. Like to see how it turns out.

Don't like ARB's cause of the maintenance issues. Have thought about removing the DPX2's ARB and replacing with a nylon bushing. The main feature of this Accurate is; 3 dogs as a back-up system for the ARB("Dawg Pound"). I'll take a bit of back-play if I don't godda deal with ARB problems.

 Just bought a Diawa BG 8000, with an ARB and a back-up dog in the gear box. One of the MANY reasons I bought it, was the ARB in this'n does have metal springs. Disadvantage: corrosion. Advantage: spring action should last much longer than the plastic type. Weak springs can cause slippage. Some say slipping has to do with grease on the ARB rollers, maybe both weakness and grease together are the problem...?
Am selling the 8000 slightly below cost, cause it's too heavy, in favor of a 5000 size, sos I can cast for a few hours without arm fatigue. Always best to hold a product in your hands before you buy. The 5000 Diawa is the same size as a Shimano Stratic 8000 (which is what I'm replacing) and it fooled me.

Above ARB info. based mostly on Allen Hawk reel review.
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jurelometer
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« Reply #31 on: June 26, 2020, 02:59:29 PM »

Cool. Like to see how it turns out.

Don't like ARB's cause of the maintenance issues. Have thought about removing the DPX2's ARB and replacing with a nylon bushing. The main feature of this Accurate is; 3 dogs as a back-up system for the ARB("Dawg Pound"). I'll take a bit of back-play if I don't godda deal with ARB problems.

 Just bought a Diawa BG 8000, with an ARB and a back-up dog in the gear box. One of the MANY reasons I bought it, was the ARB in this'n does have metal springs. Disadvantage: corrosion. Advantage: spring action should last much longer than the plastic type. Weak springs can cause slippage. Some say slipping has to do with grease on the ARB rollers, maybe both weakness and grease together are the problem...?
Am selling the 8000 slightly below cost, cause it's too heavy, in favor of a 5000 size, sos I can cast for a few hours without arm fatigue. Always best to hold a product in your hands before you buy. The 5000 Diawa is the same size as a Shimano Stratic 8000 (which is what I'm replacing) and it fooled me.

Above ARB info. based mostly on Allen Hawk reel review.

I read up a bit on one-way bearings, after getting sick of the failures.  Here is what I found:

These gizmos work by jamming the rollers between the shaft and the one-per-roller ramps on the outer "race".  I think that most reels use  roller clutches (they are not technically bearings since they are not designed to bear load)with springs that push the rollers toward the  open position, but I could be wrong.  In order for the clutch to grab, there has to be some freeplay in the system, so that one of the rollers catches a little between the shaft and the ramp on the outer "race".   This causes the race to shift a little, so now another roller starts to catch, and so on.  If everything is nice and clean and unimpeded, all the rollers catch and ride all the way up the ramps, getting a nice solid jam. The rollers jam the shaft to the outer race, and the outer race/housing has flat sides or some other feature to prevent it from spinning in the housing/sideplate.

  If the clutch does slip, you are getting metal on metal scraping, and the clutch is going to lose jamming strength, screwing up the part.

Anything that impedes the races or rollers (all of which must  move around easily) will interfere with the functioning of roller clutches.  Also, in order to make the rollers and races hard, a heat treatable metal is used.  440c stainless is the usual choice (same as ball bearings).  A fine stainless for freshwater, but the higher carbon content required for heat treating means that 440c is much less saltwater resistant than something like 316.

So if you do not lubricate at all, the clutch will work the most reliably with the greatest stopping power UNTIL saltwater starts corroding it.   Use a grease, and you will minimize corrosion, but the clutch will not jam/unjam as well (if at all).  Using a thin film lubricant (like Boeshield) will protect without impeding free motion, but  it will decrease the coefficient of friction, meaning the clutch will slip at a lighter load.  And these thin film lubricants are not going to last too long with the rollers rubbing against the races hard while jamming.   Oils gets you somewhere in between.

I will defer to the experts here that repair a lot of reels on where the tradeoff should be in terms of what (if any) lubricant to use.   In general, less and thin is better, but  it will mean more frequent maintanence.

I am not a believer in these roller clutches in saltwater reels.  

If you decide to replace the clutch with a nylon bushing, make sure that the fit is not too tight.  Nylon can absorb quite a bit of water and will swell.  The original fit had to be sort of loose anyways in order for the roller clutch to function.


-J
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 01:25:57 PM by jurelometer » Logged
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« Reply #32 on: June 26, 2020, 03:03:57 PM »

Getting back to cleaning one of the gizmos. The top solvent for salt is fresh water. Warm and moving, if possible.  As long as the water can get to where the salt is and stay in contact with the rest of the water,  it will dilute the salt quickly.  Trapped salt  in tight spots can be a bit more tricky to get good water exposure to. 

I never understood why folks here are afraid to get stainless wet, but will load up their dishwasher with 300 series stainless silverware and pots and pans  Huh?

Note that you are trying to get rid of chlorides, so don't soak reels in a swimming pool,or other highly chlorinated environment.
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Gfish
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« Reply #33 on: June 26, 2020, 06:16:46 PM »

Thanks J. Excellent and detailed explanation! What about vinegar?
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jurelometer
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« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2020, 11:57:51 AM »

Thanks J. Excellent and detailed explanation! What about vinegar?
Vinegar is usually 95% water, so it should probably work.  But might as well use plain water.  The water is what does the work for dissolving and diluting the salt.

The acetic acid in vinegar can be used to  remove some oxides (including corrosion) off of some metals, but I don't know which.  It will also break down the lubricants.

-J
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« Reply #35 on: June 29, 2020, 02:27:30 PM »

Thanks for all the advice, I ended up spraying some CRC carburetor cleaner through the AR bearings since they looked to be all metal. Then lightly hit them with compressed air, I did this twice then with a dry rag I ran it through the inside of bearings where driveshaft is inserted and spun rag counterclockwise as Alan recommended to dry out what remaining fluid might be left then oiled each bearing generously with ReelX CorrosionX oil and everything seems to work just fine and smooth.
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