Installing Ultimate Upgrade 5+ on G440T, is this under gear washer correct?

[Recoil Rob]

Here's the pic, the under gear CF washer that came with the kit is about 1/2 the size of the original, can this be correct?

After reading around it looks like Newells are supposed to use a Delrin under the gear?

[Swami805]

It looks like a 4 stack gear sleeve so it should have a full size CF washer. Don't see many G's with the 4 stack so I can see why it would have come with a small washer for a 3 stack.

[Recoil Rob]

No, a 3 stack, 3 metal, 3 fiber and a belleville.

[Swami805]

Is that metal washer attached to the gear sleeve so there's a drag washer under the gear? If it is it's a 4 stack, a 3 stack has all the drag washers inside the gear and that small washer would go between the gear and the AR gear.

[Recoil Rob]

Yes, that washer is attached to the sleeve. There was nothing between the AR gear and the bottom plate.

So that was a 4th drag washer under the main gear. Which sets up the question how do I install the new 5 washer kit?

[reel man]

It appears someone has installed a P series main gear in your reel, and that will be confirmed by looking at the bottom of the main gear to see if has a counter bore to accommodate a full size drag washer. You can try to locate a correct main gear (no recess) to install the 5 stack drag kit in the correct main gear which will give you a lot more drag than the old configuration.

[Recoil Rob]

That someone was Carl Newell. I bought this reel new about 30 years ago, first time it's ever been apart.

I looked to confirm I could use the drag washers I bought in a 229M, but no, same 4 stack.

I get the feeling Newell went off the reservation when it suited him.

[Swami805]

Nice upgrade to a 4 stack from a 3. The washers are the same size as a penn 500, if you have one those you could use that too. It should work ok with the small washer until you get a full size one. You could also use the old one in a pinch.

[Recoil Rob]

I've been in touch with the seller who knows Bryan, they're going to discuss it as apparently this is a real one-off, I bought it new and it came form Newell this way.

[MarkT]

Some of the early G's had P gears and yours looks to be one of them! Good deal for you. With a full size Carbontex Jigmaster washer underneath the gear and one of Bryan's souped up kits inside you should be good to go!

[Recoil Rob]

Should anything go on the shaft before the sleeve, under the AR ratchet? And how many washers inside the top of the gear?

[Recoil Rob]

It appears someone has installed a P series main gear in your reel, and that will be confirmed by looking at the bottom of the main gear to see if has a counter bore to accommodate a full size drag washer. You can try to locate a correct main gear (no recess) to install the 5 stack drag kit in the correct main gear which will give you a lot more drag than the old configuration.

That is the bottom of the main gear in the photo, you can see the recess. That steel washer attached to the top of the AR ratchet fits into it with a fiber washer in between.

[Bryan Young]

PM me your address and I'll send you a full size under gear washer.  This is the same washer used in the old p-series and very few first runs of the g-series.

The under gear washer that is provided with your kit is for all other Newell's.

[Recoil Rob]

Some of the early G's had P gears and yours looks to be one of them! Good deal for you. With a full size Carbontex Jigmaster washer underneath the gear and one of Bryan's souped up kits inside you should be good to go!

'

Mark, why would I need a different washer under the gear than the ones in the stack inside it? They are the same size.

[Recoil Rob]

PM me your address and I'll send you a full size under gear washer.  This is the same washer used in the old p-series and very few first runs of the g-series.

The under gear washer that is provided with your kit is for all other Newell's.

Thanks Bryan, just to clarify, the under gear washer is identical size to the washers in the stack.

And I am still confused as how this goes together.

What goes under the gear?

What goes over the gear?

Here's the kit I'm told will work, I see 6 large CF washers and one small one. 5 large washers go in the stack with the 4 steel washers. 1 large washer goes in the recess in the bottom of the main gear. (Are these all the same thickness?)

Where does the smaller CF washer go?