Clearly, a Penn 49

Started by Crow, September 19, 2019, 03:16:25 PM

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Crow

    OK, I'm starting down a path that will *probably* take me to "never never land", but...if I can pull it off, it should be a "10" on the "neat scale".  I've seen those, rare examples of old reels that are "clear"...or. "see through", so, I decided to try to make a "clear" 49 ! I've ran the "plan" though my head....multiple times ::).....and have been gathering up my supplies. Yesterday, I started by getting the side plates, and spool halves, ready to be used for the "master mold", which will be silicone. I still need to "plug" all the screw holes with something....small lengths of wooded dowel is the plan....and then make "forms" (same as when pouring concrete) from wood, to shape the outside of the silicone "pour". I'll need one form for each side of each plate, and one for each end , of each spool "half". Plan is, to make them on the wood lathe.
   I started "cleaning up" the "masters", by removing the click ratchet from the end of the spool shaft...a small Dremel bit cut through the solder, pretty quickly. I was afraid to try "un soldering" it with a torch, lest I damage the plastic spool. Once the ratchet is removed...the shaft pushes out of the spool, quite easily, freeing up the two spool "halves".
   Getting the tail plate ready was done by removing the click spring (this one was mounted with two "rivets"), leaving the 'stubs" from the rivets "standing proud" of the plate....then removing the click button, and tongue.  Then, I did a "test fit" of the metal trim rings....they were "too tight a fit", so, using a home made "scraper", made from an old screwdriver, I worked the edges of the plate, until the trim rings were an "easy" fit.
   Head plate was "readied" by, first, removing the metal "collar" from the hole that the gear sleeve exits the reel.....it's just "pushed" into the plate (from the outside), and secured by several "burrs" made on the inside edge. I found a socket that was a pretty good fit, to use as a "pusher", set the plate over a hole in the bench , and pushed the collar out. Then, I used a small 90 degree "pick" to push the "oiler" out of the plate. Another 'test fit' of rings...and a lot more scraping !...and it's ready !
   No doubt, this whole project will stretch out , well into next summer! But, if you never start...you'll never finish!  So ....it has begun !!
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

xjchad

Wow, can't wait to see this Arlyn!  What a cool project!  8)
Husband, Father, Fisherman

foakes

This is obviously a labor of love, and should be a real neat project, Crow --

If there are any parts you find you are lacking, or need better of -- let me know, and if I have them -- they are yours -- N/C.

Looking forward to your pictures and description of methods!

Best,

Fred
The Official, Un-Authorized Service and Restoration Center for quality vintage spinning reels.

D-A-M Quick, Penn, Mitchell, and ABU/Zebco Cardinals

--------

The first rule of fishing is to fish where the fish are. The second rule of fishing is to never forget the first rule.

"Enjoy the little things in Life — For someday, you may look back — and realize that they were the big things"
                                                     Fred O.

Crow

    For the threaded inserts .....which are cast into the plates, for the bearings to "screw into"....I was "lucky enough" ???....to have gotten a few "ebay" reels that had plates too badly broken to repair....so, I just "finished" breaking them, to salvage the inserts.  Even if I am successful at pulling this off...I don't ever expect to actually "fish" this thing, I doubt the clear acrylic would be strong enough to stand being threaded and /or supporting the bearings, without some sort of metal insert. Also, when (make that "IF") I get that far...the "under bearing" spring on the tail bearing, will need to be MUCH "weaker"(the springs function is to stop the bearing from either "un screwing, or screwing itself tighter" when the reel is in use)to keep the bearing "insert" from breaking out of the acrylic. Both eccentric springs will need to be "re made' from "weaker" material, as well, to protect the spring "stop" from breaking off, under the pressure.
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

Donnyboat

Sounds good Arlyn, will be watching closely & keenly, cant wait, cheers Don.
Don, or donnyboat

oc1

That's an ambitious project.  Best of luck with it all.
-steve

Crow

    I had a bit of time, yesterday afternoon, so I cut up some "scraps" of 3/4 ply, and some of 3/4 pine, and glued up some blocks to use for the wooden "forms" for the silicone. Our son manages a factory that builds new pallets, and packing crates, and "rebuilds" old pallets....so I get lots of "scraps" (and quite a bit of firewood, too ;)). Then, this morning.....raining like crazy!....I started in turning the rough shapes of the cavities.  I *thought* I needed a fairly rough surface,to give the silicone something to "bite into", so, after I did the rough turning, I used the corner of an old file, as a tool....and "roughed the heck " out of them! ::).
    I matched each "bottom" with it's "top", and installed some home made dowel pins (wood screws, with the heads cut off), so the 'front , and back, of each plate would be in the correct orientation . I also drilled a pair of "angled holes, to provide more "bite" for the silicone. To try to prevent waste, I tried to keep the "cavities" as small as possible, while still giving at least 1/8 inch of room for the silicone.
    I still need to put a coat of sealer on the edges of the forms...where they will "mate" with one another...so the silicone (and later, the resin) won't "glue" them together, and, drill the fill holes, and the "vent" holes. I'm also thinking I'll need to install some small "pins" on the interiors, to hold the "master" in the correct position , so it doesn't "shift around, before the silicone sets.
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

Cor

Seems an ambitious but fun project.   Having fished one of those reels for many years I look forward to see photos of the eventual result.

https://www.smooth-on.com/ make a variety of very strong and clear casting resins that may suit this project.

Good luck!
Cornelis

Crow

  "Smooth on" is the brand of silicone that I have....I tried an experiment, using 100% silicone caulk ("washed" in soapy water, as a catalyst, as per some "google instructions) and felt that it wasn't going to work well, considering all the "nooks & crannies" and the inside of the head plate. The stuff was to thick, and "doughy" to get a lot of detail.  I may try it, again, in making the "spool" molds, as doing it that way is MUCH cheaper !
   I did use a bit of time, this morning , "sealing" the mating edges of the forms, and experimenting with some "pins" to hold the "masters" centered in the forms. "She Who Must Be Obeyed" informed me that "we" weren't working in the shop, today...even though it was raining.....so ! ::)
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

Dominick

Can't wait...buy "she who must be obeyed" a dozen roses and ask "pretty please."  I want to see your progress.  Dominick
Leave the gun.  Take the cannolis.

There are two things I don't like about fishing.  Getting up early in the morning and boats.  The rest of it is fun.

Cor

Smooth on sell a wide variety of different silicones and other resins that I've used to make moulds and cast lures from.   It is important that you find the stuff most suitable for your application.     Description and applications are all on their site.
Some silicones are hardly liquid and also end up very hard when cured, but others are thin and runny and easy to work with.
I've worked with Mould Max 20, 30 & 60 and some other silicones.    I think 30 should  have an acceptable viscosity for what you plan to do, but check the specks.   Also consider if you require flex in the mould to remove the items?

I love working with the stuff, if you make a silicone mold it always amazes me in what fine detail the end result comes out the mold.    You see the very tiniest mark on the duplicate.

The manner in which you pour the silicone is also important to avoid bubbles in the mould.   

Good luck
Cornelis

milne

Arlyn, I am really really really watching this with interest....

  Keep the progress Pic's coming !!!

Col

Crow

Quote from: Dominick on September 22, 2019, 06:37:12 PM
Can't wait...buy "she who must be obeyed" a dozen roses and ask "pretty please."  I want to see your progress.  Dominick

She's already got more than 5000 sq. ft.of "flower gardens" (that "we" get to take care of  ;)), so I don't think  a dozen roses will quite cut it ::)

It'll probably be a few days before I get back to 'reel work", as it is supposed to be "dry" outside, and I'll have "real work' to do !!
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

Crow

   Had a few hours to work on the 49 today...no pictures of these 'steps", though...Rita (my wife) had the camera, at a party! And, as "messy" as this stage was...it's probably a good thing, or the camera would have been a mess !
   I cut short (about 1/8") sections of dowel rod, and "plugged" all the stand and post screws, in both plates......all I feel I need is the "location" of those holes, and the silicone molding agent , pushing through them, would have made the "master" much harder to remove, and, I think the silicone is "too wimpy", to make an accurate 'screw hole'...we'll see If that was a good call, or not :P. I also drilled a small hole in the tailplate, where the click spring screw would go, and re shaped a 5-40 stainless nut, to act as an anchor point for the screw...I'll cover that in more detail, later. Another thing that got "plugged" , were the shaft holes in the spool halves....again, I left "some" hole "unplugged" at each end...about 3/16"...just enough to locate the hole, for later drilling out to the correct diameter.
   Then, the messy part ! I mixed the two parts of the silicone molding agent...it's MUCH thicker than I expected ! Filled 1/2 of the wooden form, and "brushed "(actually *smeared*) some of the mix on the bottom of the plate, trying to fill as many of the "nooks and crannies", as I could, and then pushed the inverted (the mix is too thick to have "run off" the bottom side of the plate !), and pushed the plate into the filled "form". As you can imagine, the "mix" forced itself out of the holes in the plate, that weren't previously plugged....in the case of the tail plate...that was the "bearing" hole, and the slotted hole for the click button, and for the head plate, the 4 bridge screw holes were left unplugged.....trying to plug those would have ...I *think*...made an "air bubble", and not allowed the mix to get into the ares where the yoke springs fit. The "gear sleeve hole, and both eccentric handle holes were left "open, as well....I'll explain my "thinking" (or not thinking !) on that step, later.
   I repeated the "smearing", "pouring" and "embedding" the master into the mix, for the other plate, as well as for each spool half. By that time...me, the table, which I had covered with a "sacrificial" chunk of thin plywood, the tools, and everything within arms length, were pretty much a sticky, gooey, mess ! ::)
   The "cure time" for the silicone mix is about an hour and a half, but, I'm going to wait until tomorrow (maybe longer, depending on "our schedule" :D)to start 'trimming the silicone that "oozed"out of the form, and starting to get ready to pour the silicone into the forms for the "other half" of each plate, and the "other end" of each spool half.  It remains to be seen, if the silicone has gotten into all the places it needs to be...and if I can get the "masters" out, with out destroying my work ! I suppose I *should* have gotten some "real" release agent, but opted for "spray silicone" instead....that might turn out to be something I regret !!......later !!
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !

Crow

   Well, I'm definitely in a "learning experience" ::). I brought 2 of the forms into the "house shop" this morning, and after a little work with the razor knife.....trimming off areas , like the shaft, and bearing holes....had "oozed" through, and needed to be "squared off"...popped the masters from the silicone !  OOPS !  As you can see, the head plate "mold" has a pretty large "void" :-[. I *think* it's repairable....I'll try to "brush" some silicone into that area, and re insert the master. If that "fails", I'll start over with a "complete, new, pour".
   The spool half mold came out perfect. I should have time to "clean up" the other two "molds", this morning, and *maybe* try to repair the head plate mold, this late afternoon.
   The silicone is really easy to "strip" ....so I guess the "spray silicone, as a release agent, is doing OK. The "important parts" of the head plate mold look really good...nice , crisp detail, and "full coverage" in all the nooks, and crannies...so , except for my "goof" along the edge...I'm calling it a "do able" project !
   When I'm satisfied with the quality of all the mold components, I'll need to make some "pour", and "vent" holes for the clear resin.
    You can see, from the pix, just what I meant about "messy" ;D
There's nothing wrong with a few "F's" on your record....Food, Fun, Flowers, Fishing, Friends, and Fun....to name just a few !