Information needed for diy welded rings

gstours · November 14, 2019, 08:46:46 PM

I have a need to try this on some jigs and replace the split ring idea. Butt not sure if I have the right material or equipment/tools. Any information would be great. Thanks.

RowdyW · November 14, 2019, 08:54:39 PM

Why go through the trouble when they can be ordered cheaply through Bass Pro Shops. Or is it just something to do in those looong winters?

Rudy

Bill B · November 14, 2019, 10:53:23 PM

Gary, many moons ago when I was part of the Senor Tuna website, a member there did a tutorial on brazing the rings, not welding.....I would recommend brazing as it leaves a smoother joint than welding, where you would have to file or sand to prevent cutting your line if tying directly to the jig....havent been to that website since finding AT.com, dont know if they are still active. I cant access the website from my work computer due to their filters, but they dont filter AT.com, shhhh dont tell them

Bill

Dominick · November 14, 2019, 11:23:52 PM

I was at Jon Vadney's house on a day he was soldering rings. He said solder will be strong enough to weld rings. I have no experience with them. Dominick

SevenYearsDown · November 14, 2019, 11:54:56 PM

I use a Blazer Torch, some stay silv black, and silver solder. I use my fly vise to hold either the hook or the ring for the jig. The rings are cheaper to get at chain mail stores online.

SevenYearsDown · November 15, 2019, 12:02:30 AM

Here

gstours · November 15, 2019, 02:58:22 AM

Thanks. firstly bass stuff is generally intended for bass. I need at least 150# test rings, and to install the ring on a jig they have to be 5/8 3/4 inch minimum to spread enough to install. If the ring doesent have enough spring and wire diameter they stay open and are deformed post install. Finding larger split rings presently fuels the post. I generally make my own stuff if I cant find what I need economically

I guess I meant solder instead of weld. Will silver solder bond to stainless steel wire? or do i need brass wire? The torch pictured might be a butane type? Do i need Mapp gas? Just wondering.

David Hall · November 15, 2019, 03:54:42 AM

The black flux, silver solder and brazing torch are all readily available online.

oc1 · November 15, 2019, 04:29:19 AM

If you get the silver solder at a jeweler's supply you can choose "easy", "medium", or "hard" solder. The easy flows at a lower temperature but is not quite as strong. Hard flows at a higher temperature and is stronger. "Easy" solder would be strong enough for this application and it is easier to work with. You can quickly get the ring too hot so the torch melts it. If you buy silver solder at an air conditioning supply it will be really hard and difficult to work with.

I use the white Stay Silv because it is easier to watch it get to the right temperature. Whether you use white or black, the important thing is to have the ring really really clean and shiny before applying the flux. Buff the ring with a piece of sand paper to make sure any clear finish is removed.

After soldering, you need to wash/scrub the flux off and you might want to pickle it with some vinegar. Sometimes the flux will form a glass-like coating that is not removed with a quick rinse. Silver solder will corrode and any flux remnants will make it corrode faster.
-steve

SevenYearsDown · November 15, 2019, 06:06:12 AM

Quote from: gstours on November 15, 2019, 02:58:22 AM
Thanks. firstly bass stuff is generally intended for bass. I need at least 150# test rings, and to install the ring on a jig they have to be 5/8 3/4 inch minimum to spread enough to install. If the ring doesent have enough spring and wire diameter they stay open and are deformed post install. Finding larger split rings presently fuels the post. I generally make my own stuff if I cant find what I need economically

I guess I meant solder instead of weld. Will silver solder bond to stainless steel wire? or do i need brass wire? The torch pictured might be a butane type? Do i need Mapp gas? Just wondering.

That little butane torch is all you needed. I used to use a torch meant for searing steaks and such, the flame was too wide. A friend gifted me two of these, and the flame is MUCH more controllable. It only takes a few seconds to heat the ring up for the silver solder to flow. If you want you can have my extra torch, it's unused.

Caranx · November 15, 2019, 07:02:43 PM

Quote from: oc1 on November 15, 2019, 04:29:19 AM
If you get the silver solder at a jeweler's supply you can choose "easy", "medium", or "hard" solder. The easy flows at a lower temperature but is not quite as strong. Hard flows at a higher temperature and is stronger. "Easy" solder would be strong enough for this application and it is easier to work with. You can quickly get the ring too hot so the torch melts it. If you buy silver solder at an air conditioning supply it will be really hard and difficult to work with.

I use the white Stay Silv because it is easier to watch it get to the right temperature. Whether you use white or black, the important thing is to have the ring really really clean and shiny before applying the flux. Buff the ring with a piece of sand paper to make sure any clear finish is removed.

After soldering, you need to wash/scrub the flux off and you might want to pickle it with some vinegar.
Sometimes the flux will form a glass-like coating that is not removed with a quick rinse. Silver solder will corrode and any flux remnants will make it corrode faster.
-steve

Great info! Wish I saw your pst earlier. Would have saved me a lot of money and heart ache!!

Dominick · November 15, 2019, 08:04:06 PM

That is pretty much what Jon Vadney was doing. Easy peazy. Dominick

gstours · November 17, 2019, 01:28:36 AM

Many thanks for the information,

I have several butatne torches so now I need the answer can I solder stainless steel wire? What grades is there a spafic type? I,m thinking some 304 sst tig rod as it is what i,ve got . seems bendable.
Should a person make a butt connection or more like a split ring and the solder? Just wondering? Thanks....

oc1 · November 17, 2019, 06:36:06 AM

Soldering stainless is more difficult than soldering brass. The stainless will flash off a layer of corrosion if you just breath on it. The soldering technique is the same though. After cleaning/buffing put on the flux immediately. Heat until it's just ready to glow and touch the silver solder to it as you continue to heat. As soon as it flows pull the torch back. Solder follows heat so you can sort of pull it around a bit by moving the torch. If it looks good enough then quit while you're ahead instead of trying to make it better. If it starts to look cruddy and the solder beads up but won't flow, then you may have to start the process over. If you keep increasing the heat for too long then you will melt the work piece and really have to start over.

To make rings I wrap the wire around a drill bit or other mandrel. Slide the coil off and use snips to cut off one wrap at a time to make rings, or two wraps at a time to make split-rings. The butt joint will work and is should be strong enough. The soldered joint will be the strongest part of the ring. The two-wrap thing will be much more rigid though so it can't even be twisted out of shape. You can also solder the whole coil at once to make a crude tube or collar or pipe.

The trickiest part is making the solder joint so nice that it doesn't need to be burnished afterwards. Its tedious to grind off excess globs of solder and get a nice smooth surface again.
-steve

gstours · November 17, 2019, 03:20:48 PM

Thanks for more info, Butt what about brass wire/rod for the ring? seems like it would solder at possibly lower temp and be easier?
I started this a while ago using copper solid elect wire, butt wasnt happy with the look, yet it did solder fine and thought it would corrode fast and lose its strength. Butt when the rocks grab and put a permenent hold on the lure it remind us nothing lasts forever?