2019 Certate LT 4000D-C in for repair

Started by ReelClean, September 23, 2020, 08:14:58 AM

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ReelClean

Came from the local tackle shop with a glitch in the gearing it seems.
I had previously procured the SST for this inevitable day and the LHS sideplate is now off.
Is it a rhetorical question to ask whether anyone wants to see the surgery as a tutorial, or is not a $*@# given?  ;D
Let's see what little traps Daiwa-san has set for we amateurs!

cheers
Steve
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

philaroman

oooh...  are we in bronze main territory, or still a few Benjamins away?
drinkin' extra coffee, so there will be extra " $*@# given" ;D

JK47

#2
Yeah, show us please. I have a Certate CXH5000LT. How much did the side plate tool cost?

ReelClean

#3
Sorry Guys, I got smashed last couple of weeks!

I posted it up here:
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1741107059363700&id=433383760136043

Finally got to open up a '19 Certate.  I was NOT surprised to discover that they are neither waterproof, nor substantially more corrosion resistant than any other reel!. They have dropped the Magsealed unitary bearings and gone back to normal bearings with magoil seals on LRB and pinion shaft seal.  This one destroyed a couple of teeth on the nylon oscillating gear.
Yes folks, that is salt water 🙁.  It was right through, so not sure, but I think it came in through the end plate.  There is a "seal" there, but it is just plastic with no grease to seal it.  That bail trip mechanism will be an ongoing corrosion issue as it is made out of some type of cast metal and swingin' out in the salt under the rotor with no protection.  Magseal plates in the LRB were already a rusty mess, I had to use the Hedgehog puller to extract it and one didn't survive the surgery.  I just do what I usually do and pack 'em with CorrosionX and MX6 grease so they have a chance of surviving!
cheers
Steve
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

ReelClean

#4
Quote from: JK47 on September 23, 2020, 05:00:26 PM
Yeah, show us please. I have a Certate CXH5000LT. How much did the side plate tool cost?
That cost about one "Benjamin" Aust!
This one will do any of the LT series up to and including 4000 size.  I am going to measure up a Saltiga this week at the friendly local TS (Lee Longs, Gordonvale Cairns for any locals: TOP place!) and see if I can manufacture an opener.  I have seen one on youtube (Profisher UA) made from nylon or similar, may have been 3D printed.  I will report back, maybe I can get a CAD file organized!
cheers
Steve
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

ReelClean

Quote from: philaroman on September 23, 2020, 01:02:56 PM
oooh...  are we in bronze main territory, or still a few Benjamins away?
drinkin' extra coffee, so there will be extra " $*@# given" ;D

Main gear is Aluminium alloy of some sort ( I am sure there is some w@nker marketing description for the metal), no bronze in sight, sorry.
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

nelz

Wow, I expected much better from such a pricey reel.  >:(

JasonGotaProblem

#7
Ok so it's a steaming pile of crap. Will remember for the future. Thank you. I've seen a few pop up used, I'm glad I never pounced.

No but seriously. I did not expect to see aluminum and freaking nylon gearing inside a $300+ reel. I am so very confused and a little bit upset. No wonder you needed a special tool to open it. They clearly had something to hide.
Any machine is a smoke machine if you use it wrong enough.

JK47

Quote from: ReelClean on October 14, 2020, 08:31:55 AM
Quote from: JK47 on September 23, 2020, 05:00:26 PM
Yeah, show us please. I have a Certate CXH5000LT. How much did the side plate tool cost?
That cost about one "Benjamin" Aust!
This one will do any of the LT series up to and including 4000 size.  I am going to measure up a Saltiga this week at the friendly local TS (Lee Longs, Gordonvale Cairns for any locals: TOP place!) and see if I can manufacture an opener.  I have seen one on youtube (Profisher UA) made from nylon or similar, may have been 3D printed.  I will report back, maybe I can get a CAD file organized!
cheers
Steve
An 3D printer file would be awesome!!

philaroman

#9
OMG, what a POS  :o  (well...  for 1/2K, it's a POS  :(  )

can you point to ANYTHING that even remotely begins to contemplate approaching a justification for the price-tag?

JasonGotaProblem

Quote from: philaroman on October 14, 2020, 10:53:51 PM
OMG, what a POS  :o  (well...  for 1/2K, it's a POS  :(  )

can you point to ANYTHING that even remotely begins to contemplate approaching a justification for the price-tag?
My BG has better materials for gears. And it's $100 (well i paid 75 on sale but that's even worse!) And it's a daiwa so it really is a fair apples to apples comparison price wise.

How much do they really think that mag sealing stuff is worth? The more I think about this the grumpier I get.
Any machine is a smoke machine if you use it wrong enough.

ReelClean

#11
Quote from: philaroman on October 14, 2020, 10:53:51 PM
OMG, what a POS  :o  (well...  for 1/2K, it's a POS  :(  )

can you point to ANYTHING that even remotely begins to contemplate approaching a justification for the price-tag?

I have about 6 Certates and I luv 'em, but not one of them is later than 2010 model, some are 2004.  I reckon past that they dropped the ball (or more likely the beancounters/marketing  got involved in engineering).  It's a NICE reel, but not an outstanding reel, but then again neither is a Stella for the stupid $$$ they want for one.
If it were me, I would go a Luvias (of which I have two).  Both models are Japan made, but the Luvias I believe is a lot cheaper.
And if you want a bargain in something larger, I just worked on a 10000SW Saragosa.  The waterproofing is fantastic with a full perimeter o ring around the body. I opened up that sucker, saw no discolored grease or water ingress, so I just pumped some MX6 grease in and buttoned that puppy up again.  If it ain't broke, dont ^%$# with it!  ;D  LRB was a bit sketchy, but they all are!
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

ReelClean

Quote from: JasonGotaPenn on October 15, 2020, 02:49:52 AM
Quote from: philaroman on October 14, 2020, 10:53:51 PM
OMG, what a POS  :o  (well...  for 1/2K, it's a POS  :(  )

can you point to ANYTHING that even remotely begins to contemplate approaching a justification for the price-tag?
My BG has better materials for gears. And it's $100 (well i paid 75 on sale but that's even worse!) And it's a daiwa so it really is a fair apples to apples comparison price wise.

How much do they really think that mag sealing stuff is worth? The more I think about this the grumpier I get.

Mag sealing is just another way of preventing water ingress; it is no better nor worse than using a rubber seal, just different.  It is NOT sealed for life despite what the BS Artists in marketing may suggest.  They both need regular maintenance to keep the salt out.  If it were rubber you would service it every season and pack it with grease; for magseal you service it every season and replenish the oil.  Sama sama!
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

ReelClean

#13
Quote from: JK47 on September 23, 2020, 05:00:26 PM
Yeah, show us please. I have a Certate CXH5000LT. How much did the side plate tool cost?

I spent an hour at Lee Longs TS this morning measuring the sidecovers on several sizes of Saltigas and Certates.  There are four different sizes of tool required for the sideplates over the range!
Maybe they should just weld them on so I don't have to worry.  Use the Apple marketing model: sorry, we can't fix it, but we can sell you this new (but unimproved) version for a "special" price.  They could use the "I"diot marketing model;  how about Da"I"wa (tm)?
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.

ReelClean

#14
Quote from: JasonGotaPenn on October 14, 2020, 07:04:34 PM
Ok so it's a steaming pile of crap. Will remember for the future. Thank you. I've seen a few pop up used, I'm glad I never pounced.

No but seriously. I did not expect to see aluminum and freaking nylon gearing inside a $300+ reel. I am so very confused and a little bit upset. No wonder you needed a special tool to open it. They clearly had something to hide.

..and I forgot to mention that the nylon gear is probably the engineered fuse point; I suspect this reel was used in an attempt to winch a GT out from under a bommie!  It is the only way that I can see you stripping it, and it may have saved the main gear/pinion gear/body from damage, the gear is only a $3 part.
Specialist Daiwa reel service, including Magseal.