alan tani @ alantani.com fishing reel repair rebuild tutorial Bearings
Reel Repair by Alan Tani
November 29, 2020, 03:21:47 AM *
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JasonGotaPenn
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« Reply #30 on: November 18, 2020, 04:34:13 PM »



You just need to know inches per handle revolution- which is usually included in the specs (or you can calculate from filled spool circumference times gear ratio) and divide by the roller circumference.  Multiply this by how fast you expect turn the handle.
It's been a long week. I realized they publish that number as I was driving home.
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I just saw some ABEC 9 skateboard bearings on that  evil world's largest web retailer site: 16 for 9 bucks  Roll Eyes   There is market demand  for low cost, high ABEC rated bearings that is met with low quality product.

-J
Skateboard bearings are an expression of what happens when there's a certain size that's very common. It gets cheaper. You can get a full ceramic skate bearing (which only differs in size from the ones for my reel by 1.5mm of the ID) for 8 bucks a pop. For my reel it would be $45 each from the same supplier. No I don't wanna go full ceramic in my reel. Just trying to give an apples to apples or close to it.

And just use bones bearings for skateboards.
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« Reply #31 on: November 18, 2020, 10:02:22 PM »

see if you can find same-size bushings...  pref., Oilite
Everyone poo-poos bushings.  ABU is said to have noted that bushing are just as good as ball bearings for spool bearings but the market likes the idea of ball bearings.  My experience with small baitcasters is that, yes indeed, you can get just as much distance from bushings as ball bearings.  I am very glad to have made the transition from ball bearings to bushings because bushings require less maintenance, especially in harsh conditions where the reel is always getting wet.

Bushing do require more frequent lubrication/oiling though.  Oiling a bushing reel is a 20 second job if you are set up for it with oil ports in all the right places and an oil dispenser sized for the oil ports.  I oil my baitcasters about every four or five hours of continual casting and retrieving.  A squirt of oil in each spool bearing, the gear shaft, the main gear faces, the pinion, the clutch, the clicker and the handle knob.  Frequent heavy oiling of bushings with a light oil (it's a squirt, not a drop) will effectively flush out emulsion and sludge.

With ball bearings, I was getting about twenty hours of cast/retrieve before the ball bearings had to be removed from the reel, cleaned to get rid of emulsion and sludge and replaced.  Depending on reel design, this was taking at least thirty minutes and sometimes an hour. 

Ball Bearings: 30 minutes maintenance every 20  hours of use = 1.5 minute of maintenance per hour of use.

Bushings: 20 seconds (or 0.33 minutes) maintenance for every 4 hours of use = 0.8 minutes of maintenance per hour of use.

The bushing reel can be oiled while bouncing around in the ocean.  The ball bearing reel has to be taken to the workbench.  Figure that both reels will have to be completely broken down for one reason or another at least once a year.

Your results may vary.  I do not know if bushings will cause more or accelerated wear than ball bearings.  I do not know if a modern baitcasting reel can be modified/outfitted for frequent and easy heavy oiling.  I use a light pneumatic tool oil in one of those little Shakespeare chrome over brass oil cans.

-steve
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« Reply #32 on: November 18, 2020, 10:17:48 PM »

For ball bearings, I found a lot of variation in free spin time in those ten-pack deals.  Two or three would usually be much better than the rest.  Buying ball bearings may just be a crap shoot.
-steve
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JasonGotaPenn
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« Reply #33 on: November 18, 2020, 10:41:41 PM »

For ball bearings, I found a lot of variation in free spin time in those ten-pack deals.  Two or three would usually be much better than the rest.  Buying ball bearings may just be a crap shoot.
-steve
I find myself wondering if quality bearing brands actually just make a ton of bearings and only label the top maybe 10% as their own and sell the others on Amazon under a different brand 10 for $5.
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« Reply #34 on: November 18, 2020, 10:46:37 PM »

Could be.  Somewhere on the internet there is a Japanese reel tuning group who claim they individually select the best bearings in a lot.  You have to wonder where all their culls go.
-steve
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jurelometer
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« Reply #35 on: November 19, 2020, 12:47:14 AM »

see if you can find same-size bushings...  pref., Oilite
Everyone poo-poos bushings.  ABU is said to have noted that bushing are just as good as ball bearings for spool bearings but the market likes the idea of ball bearings.  My experience with small baitcasters is that, yes indeed, you can get just as much distance from bushings as ball bearings.  I am very glad to have made the transition from ball bearings to bushings because bushings require less maintenance, especially in harsh conditions where the reel is always getting wet.

Bushing do require more frequent lubrication/oiling though.  Oiling a bushing reel is a 20 second job if you are set up for it with oil ports in all the right places and an oil dispenser sized for the oil ports.  I oil my baitcasters about every four or five hours of continual casting and retrieving.  A squirt of oil in each spool bearing, the gear shaft, the main gear faces, the pinion, the clutch, the clicker and the handle knob.  Frequent heavy oiling of bushings with a light oil (it's a squirt, not a drop) will effectively flush out emulsion and sludge.

With ball bearings, I was getting about twenty hours of cast/retrieve before the ball bearings had to be removed from the reel, cleaned to get rid of emulsion and sludge and replaced.  Depending on reel design, this was taking at least thirty minutes and sometimes an hour. 

Ball Bearings: 30 minutes maintenance every 20  hours of use = 1.5 minute of maintenance per hour of use.

Bushings: 20 seconds (or 0.33 minutes) maintenance for every 4 hours of use = 0.8 minutes of maintenance per hour of use.

The bushing reel can be oiled while bouncing around in the ocean.  The ball bearing reel has to be taken to the workbench.  Figure that both reels will have to be completely broken down for one reason or another at least once a year.

Your results may vary.  I do not know if bushings will cause more or accelerated wear than ball bearings.  I do not know if a modern baitcasting reel can be modified/outfitted for frequent and easy heavy oiling.  I use a light pneumatic tool oil in one of those little Shakespeare chrome over brass oil cans.

-steve

Agree with you on plain bearings  (bushings) vs ball bearings.   Also, ball bearings can fail catastrophically, vs plain bearings just gradually wearing down and getting looser.

The typical deep groove ball bearings have one advantage:  By using balls and round tracks on the races, they are tolerant of misalignment.  Plain bearings cannot twist a little to adapt to misalignment, and have to go through a break-in period to wear into shape instead. But if the bearing fit is not super tight, it is usually not noticeable, and you can spend less of your life cleaning and re-lubing.

I disagree with folks that say that ball bearings are inherently stronger than plain bearings.  Just look inside most engines...

-J.
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nelz
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« Reply #36 on: November 19, 2020, 05:29:37 AM »

Everyone poo-poos bushings.  ABU is said to have noted that bushing are just as good as ball bearings for spool bearings but the market likes the idea of ball bearings

Bushings are fine as spool bearings, but in spinners, the line roller tends to jam with bushings.
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philaroman
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« Reply #37 on: November 19, 2020, 10:06:31 AM »

Everyone poo-poos bushings.  ABU is said to have noted that bushing are just as good as ball bearings for spool bearings but the market likes the idea of ball bearings

Bushings are fine as spool bearings, but in spinners, the line roller tends to jam with bushings.

I'm sure that's true for a SINGLE line-roller bushing, because the roller is less stable -- it rocks (not in a good way Sad )
J has JUST explained why that effects a bush more adversely than a BB, so I don't have to try (whew, thanks Dave)
YOU HAVE TWO!!!  ...supports on either rim of roller = no "bad rocking"

solid bushes you can play around w/ polishing ID for different performance, lube viscosity, etc. (Summer bush vs. Winter bush, haha)
that may be extra-significant, for line rollers because the break-in time is MUCH longer (roller doesn't HAVE to roll - line can slip over)
once again, having TWO symmetrically positioned supports really lets you play w/ tiny symmetrical ID slop
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« Reply #38 on: November 19, 2020, 12:01:51 PM »

I came of age with old mitchell spinners and off-brands that did not have a line roller.  The bail just had an indent that trapped the line and there was never a problem, albeit there were no long drawn-out battles with monsters.  The reels weren't really made for that anyway.  I thought I was hot graduating to spinfishers with a roller but those things are a pain to keep up with.  The bail roller is about the only thing that ever goes wrong with them, but they jammed frequently.  The easy solution was to ignore it and occasionally inspect for wear and turn the roller a few degrees by hand to distribute the wear.   I have never been fortunate enough to have the line wear a groove in the indent or the roller.

By the way, and before you ask, a stuck roller on the bail does NOT cause the line to twist any more or any less than a fully functional roller.

Then I grew up enough to only use conventional reels and life has been good ever since.
-steve
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wfjord
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« Reply #39 on: November 19, 2020, 01:11:02 PM »

I really like my reels with bushings & have no reason to consider swapping them out for BBs.  But been lucky with the ball bearings on all my old rebuilt/restored reels -- they cleaned up nicely & work fine. Haven't had to replace any so far.
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