the list - SOA 2021, october 5-13, 2021

Started by alantani, March 05, 2021, 06:13:51 PM

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Wally15

We depart Tuesday, 10/5. I fly out from GA on Monday 10/4. The only other two days available for me (us) to get tested are ln a Saturday and a Sunday. Even if I find a test facility open on the weekend, and get a negative result, I then spend 5 hours in a tin can at 40,000 ft with 300 masked strangers.
Is that potential exposure going to be a problem/concern for anyone?
If so, I arrive SD at noon on the 4th. I could probably find a testing facility in SD and get tested there???
I've had the Moderna vaccine. I somewhat believe that the vaccine helps. I'm not a fan of masks. IMO the mask of Zorro or the Lone Ranger would be just as effective as the crap masks we're required to wear.
I'm not a Dr., but I know all viruses are particulate. As are odors. If you've ever smelled a fart through several layers of clothing from someone 6+ feet away......
GA Mike

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Dylan Thomas

Ron Jones

The 2-3 days old test is important. You aren't infectious as soon as you are infected. Your body needs time to allow the virus to build up to the point that it is transmissible.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavirus-incubation-period#1

The best I understand is that it takes about 2 weeks for you to become symptomatic. So if you get a test that is negative and 2 days later get exposed you have about a week and a half before you are a transmission concern.

Get your test on the weekend, you'll be good.

The Man
Ronald Jones
To those who have gone to sea and returned and to those who have gone to sea and will never return
"

jurelometer

#32
Quote from: Ron Jones on August 25, 2021, 02:58:28 PM
The 2-3 days old test is important. You aren't infectious as soon as you are infected. Your body needs time to allow the virus to build up to the point that it is transmissible.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavirus-incubation-period#1

The best I understand is that it takes about 2 weeks for you to become symptomatic. So if you get a test that is negative and 2 days later get exposed you have about a week and a half before you are a transmission concern.

Get your test on the weekend, you'll be good.

The Man

Symptomatic is different than infectious, which is different from incubation, which is different from a test being able to detect a new infection.

If you read down past the initial 14 day incubation period statement  in Ron's WebMD  link, you will see:

On average, symptoms show up in the newly infected person about 5 days after contact.

And

Researchers estimate that people who get infected with the coronavirus can spread it to others 2 to 3 days before symptoms start and are most contagious 1 to 2 days before they feel sick.

According to a report from  MIT,  from exposure to first positive PCR test for the Delta variant  is 3-5 days.   Even you test negative the day of  your trip,  an infection that initiated in the last 72 hours probably will not be detected.

Looking only at cases for which they could determine the exact time of exposure, researchers found that the time interval from exposure to positive PCR test ranged from three to five days, with a peak at 3.71 days. In contrast, data from the 2020 outbreak showed that it took an average of six days from exposure to positive test with a range of five to eight days and a peak at 5.61.

https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2021/07/are-things-different-delta

So a negative PCR shows that as of 3-5 days before the test that you were Delta variant free (a bit longer for original flavor COVID Classic, but Delta is dominant now).  That 3-5 day window is the wildcard.  If you caught the virus, you can start spreading  it within a couple days of exposure, and before you feel symptoms.

I was planning a bit of travel recently myself and had a chance  to talk to a researcher  involved with  this stuff.  He broke down the risk like this  - from highest to lowest:

1.  Shuttles and group transports (Vans and such)
2. Taxis/Ubers
3. Airport lines/crowds,  Indoor dining
4.  The flight

Wearing a well fitting, authentic N95 or KF94 mask goes a very long way in protecting you and others in the riskier situations.  If you feel like letting your guard down a bit and actually enjoying life, outdoors in the sun is the place to be.

Quote from: Wally15 on August 25, 2021, 11:41:25 AM
IMO the mask of Zorro or the Lone Ranger would be just as effective as the crap masks we're required to wear.
I'm not a Dr., but I know all viruses are particulate. As are odors. If you've ever smelled a fart through several layers of clothing from someone 6+ feet away......


Hmm, gas vs liquid encased viral particle.  Had too look this up:


Well,  methanthiol (the molecule that makes farts smell bad) should at least 100 times smaller than a single COVID virus.  And the virus needs to be encased in something wet/gooey like  mucous or it will dessicate and be unable to reproduce, so the actual size of a dangerous COVID "package" is even larger.

In terms of bad smells, to protect from organic vapors, you need a respirator with a organic vapor cartridge.  If you are worried about your "effect" on others, they make these sealed boxer shorts with an activated charcoal exhaust filter :).  So that takes care of farts.

For particles like viruses, the hard part for a quality particulate filter is not actually the smallest particles. They are so small that intermolecular attraction/resistance to the filter and other particles causes the particle to zig zag instead of traveling on  a straight path, and it will usually bounce into a fiber and get stuck.   Large particles will simply not fit.   It is the tweener size that gets tricky.  Small enough to fit between the  fibers, but too big to get knocked off course.  These are taken care of if the filter can maintain an electrostatic charge. The charge pulls these tweener particles into the fibers.   A nice fresh N95 mask has several layers of fiber mesh (not weave) to cut down on any straight line paths, and a strong electrostatic charge to catch the tweeners.

But air is a fluid (like water), and the filter provides resistance.  Fluids will take the path of least resistance, so if the mask is not  properly fitted ( no facial hair either),  the airflow goes around the filter instead of through it.

You are right that many (most) folks half-#### their masking, and some leave their noses hanging out as an act of defiance.  Mask usage can provide a range of outbound and inbound protection from near zero to near 100%.  Go into any COVID ward and ask the DRs or RNs if the will expose themselves to a patient without wearing an N95.

Sorry to carry on on this.  I actually had to learn a bit about respirators and how build particulate filters and organic filters for some of my hobbies. I am extremely far from having any expertise, but some of the stuff going around the interwebs just makes me cringe.  People hate masks (me too!) and are looking for a reason not to wear them.  The poor quality of the reasoning is pretty damming.

Testing  closer to the date of your departure, and more importantly upping  your masking  game a bit before  and during travel to the landing will help to decrease the odds of infecting your boat mates.  It is actually  kinda Ohana-ish...

But don't take my or Ron's word for it.  Talk with your medical provider...

Hope this helps,

-J

natch!

 Hello Fellow Adventurers,

Unfortunately I will have to bow out of the 2021 trip.
We found out Thursday that my son has lymphoma. The doctors we have talked to all are very confident it will be successfully treated. Treatment will start in September or early October and I need to be here.
  I'm certain everyone is thinking "what can I do for you?. What do you need?"
  Well, I need you to have a great time.
  I need to see detailed reports, photos, and videos. Especially of you b*****es gettin' em on the iron.
  I need for some one to call the office and make sure there is enough broccoli on board to keep Warren somewhat calm.
  I need Peaches to get at least one good night's sleep.
  I need you to remember "No zing pows"! Or, ridicule those guilty of said offense mercilessly.
  Lee, I need you to catch a ride with Mike.
  I need many toasts to the well being of my family.
  I need you to listen closely to Alan, and then just carry on regardless.
Mostly just have fun, stay safe, and meet me on board in 2022.

Jack Bradley

Ron Jones

Jack, we will pray ceaselessly for you and yours. I am glad to hear the initial prognosis is good. Peaches get a good night sleep? Sorry to disappoint!!

The Man
Ronald Jones
To those who have gone to sea and returned and to those who have gone to sea and will never return
"

Keta

Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way.
Mark Twain

Wally15

Our thoughts and prayers are with you and your family, Jack. You will be with us in spirit. We'll keep you updated. And you do the same.
Unlike ALL the other guys, I don't need beauty sleep.
Take care,
Peaches
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Dylan Thomas

Keta

If you grew a beard it would hide some of the ugly  Mike.... but it does not work too well for me.
Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way.
Mark Twain

alantani

jack, i hope that this works out.  i will be sending checks out to both you and mike grosman.  

it turns out that one of our alumni will be able to take your place.  joey fortina will be back on board.  
send me an email at alantani@yahoo.com for questions!

natch!

  Thanks everybody for the kind thoughts and well wishes. I remember Joey, a great young man. Best of luck to you all.
I'm still on the Cedros trip, so I'll see some of you Monday morning at the border.

  Jack

Porthos

Jack,

Will miss sharing the rail with you. May everything with your son work out better than expectations.

Wai

Wally15

Quote from: Keta on August 26, 2021, 01:51:15 PM
If you grew a beard it would hide some of the ugly  Mike.... but it does not work too well for me.
Eat your heart out Lee!😀
GA Mike
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Dylan Thomas

Keta

#42
Nice.

Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way.
Mark Twain

oc1


Keta

Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way.
Mark Twain