avet hx right side bearing

[kazfish]

Hello Alan and other reel experts,
First post on your board so first thanks for your tutorials and all your good common sense advice.  I've been reading your stuff for awhile...please keep it up!
My question for you concerns the age old binding issue with the avet, HX in particular.  Mine gets about the same drag as my JX without binding - 10-12 lbs.  I've seen you write that the avet bearings are cheap and better quality can be found.  My question is will changing the right side bearing to one of higher quality reduce the binding?  I understand that Cal has a service that gives higher drag without binding.  Could a bearing change be what Cal is doing?

Thanks and looking forward to your reply.

John

[Roger]

I'd be calling Avet and telling them I want it fixed. Their specs call for more than that. Any ways, here's a link from BD on the bearing issue. Hope this helps.

http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/avet-reels-support/274365-avet-pinion-bearings.html

[alantani]

Does anyone have an idea about how to get more life out of the pinion bearings on Avet reels. 

the short answer is to grease the bearing and stay within specs.........

james, in my own personal (albiet limited) experience with avet reels, i would have to agree with you that the right main side plate bearing is the first to go.  i have found that to be the case in all lever drag reels, be it penn, daiwa, shimano or okuma.  in decreasing order of failure frequency, i would have to say that the right main side plate (rmsp) bearing is the most prone to failure, followed by the left spool bearing, then less but equally prone to failure would be the right spool bearing and pressure plate bearings together.  and depending on the configuration of the reel, you may have one or two handle drive shaft bearings.  the outer one will typically fail before the inner one, and the frequency of failure for the outer drive shaft will be something less than the right main side plate bearing.  james, i believe that your experience is not unique and your question is quite valid. 

i believe that there are two causes.  the first is salt water intrusion.  i open up lots of rusty bearings.  rust means that salt water got in.  it's a no brainer.  if it will help anyone that doubts that fact, i can post a hundred photos.  interestingly, avet is one of three companies (with okuma and shimano) that fully pack their right main side plate bearings with grease.  i have still found avet rmsp bearings with rust in them, so i suspect that the grease they use is not quite "runny" enough, allowing the grease to pack, create air gaps and leave places for water to collect.  likewise, i have seen shimano rmsp bearings that are open (no shields) with a grease that is too thin, allowing the grease to get thrown out, leaving the bearing exposed.  okuma will start using non-spool bearings that have an 80% fill.  this means 80% grease and 20% balls and cage.  i do not know which grease they have selected, but i am hopeful that the grease will be thick enough that it will not leak out past the shields, yet thin enough to flow and stay in contact with the hardware inside the bearing and protect it.  i have been using yamaha marine grease to pack bearings and i have been quite happy with it, though i am fiddling with inox products now.  i wish i had a systematic way to evaluate these, but i do not.  for the time being, i am sticking with yamaha marine until i have a problem AND something better comes along. 

there is also a second way to damage a right main side plate bearing.  anyone with a lever drag reel can confirm this.  find out what the absolute maximum rating for your lever drag reel is.  refer to the manual for this info.  set the strike drag to this number.  now push the lever to full, crank the handle, and feel the bearings give with every turn.  congratulations, you have just ruined your right main side plate bearing.  that was easy, wasn't it!  for those of you with an avet sx or mx, a 20 pound drag setting is usually sufficient.  obviously, i would ask that you trust me on this one and not deliberately do this.  and it will be the right main side plate bearing that fails first, not the left spool bearing.  why?  i dunno.......

james, you may have to spend a little time to get these reels dialed in.  first, i would pull the non-spool bearings and repack them with yamaha marine grease.  second, don't push them too hard.  by the time this is all said and done, you should be able to rebuild these in your sleep.  hey, maybe you'll find a new hobby!

[kazfish]

Thanks for the responses.  Lots of good info, but what I was really asking is if a higher quality bearing will reduce the handle binding, or is there anything that will alleviate binding.  Apparently Cal does something that gets 30% more drag without binding.

[alantani]

yes, a better quality bearing will increase that range by a few pounds.  boca bearings would be your best bet, but they are out of stock.  i spoke to them last week and have bearings on back order.  it's an odd size.  i just spoke to cal sheets on the phone and asked him about that.  (had a couple of other things to ask about as well.)  he can get a couple of more pounds out of the reel just by cleaning it up a little and replacing that bearing, but that's all. he said that he tried an angular contact bearing but decided that it was not worth the expense for the small amount of benefit that he got.  i asked him if it truely is a dead end, and he said yes.  that was my impression as well, but it was nice to actually hear it from him.  sorry   

[kazfish]

No apologies needed, Alan.  I am truly grateful for the research and frank reply as it helps me greatly in sorting out how to use the hx reel.  I now know that there is no hope of using it as a 60# reel, it barely qualifies as a 50# reel.

I may try upgrading that right side bearing, just for the heck of it.  Hey I might be getting hooked on this reel tinkering!

Thanks again,
John

[wallacewt]

Does anyone have an idea about how to get more life out of the pinion bearings on Avet reels. 

the short answer is to grease the bearing and stay within specs.........

james, in my own personal (albiet limited) experience with avet reels, i would have to agree with you that the right main side plate bearing is the first to go.  i have found that to be the case in all lever drag reels, be it penn, daiwa, shimano or okuma.  in decreasing order of failure frequency, i would have to say that the right main side plate (rmsp) bearing is the most prone to failure, followed by the left spool bearing, then less but equally prone to failure would be the right spool bearing and pressure plate bearings together.  and depending on the configuration of the reel, you may have one or two handle drive shaft bearings.  the outer one will typically fail before the inner one, and the frequency of failure for the outer drive shaft will be something less than the right main side plate bearing.  james, i believe that your experience is not unique and your question is quite valid. 

i believe that there are two causes.  the first is salt water intrusion.  i open up lots of rusty bearings.  rust means that salt water got in.  it's a no brainer.  if it will help anyone that doubts that fact, i can post a hundred photos.  interestingly, avet is one of three companies (with okuma and shimano) that fully pack their right main side plate bearings with grease.  i have still found avet rmsp bearings with rust in them, so i suspect that the grease they use is not quite "runny" enough, allowing the grease to pack, create air gaps and leave places for water to collect.  likewise, i have seen shimano rmsp bearings that are open (no shields) with a grease that is too thin, allowing the grease to get thrown out, leaving the bearing exposed.  okuma will start using non-spool bearings that have an 80% fill.  this means 80% grease and 20% balls and cage.  i do not know which grease they have selected, but i am hopeful that the grease will be thick enough that it will not leak out past the shields, yet thin enough to flow and stay in contact with the hardware inside the bearing and protect it.  i have been using yamaha marine grease to pack bearings and i have been quite happy with it, though i am fiddling with inox products now.  i wish i had a systematic way to evaluate these, but i do not.  for the time being, i am sticking with yamaha marine until i have a problem AND something better comes along. 

there is also a second way to damage a right main side plate bearing.  anyone with a lever drag reel can confirm this.  find out what the absolute maximum rating for your lever drag reel is.  refer to the manual for this info.  set the strike drag to this number.  now push the lever to full, crank the handle, and feel the bearings give with every turn.  congratulations, you have just ruined your right main side plate bearing.  that was easy, wasn't it!  for those of you with an avet sx or mx, a 20 pound drag setting is usually sufficient.  obviously, i would ask that you trust me on this one and not deliberately do this.  and it will be the right main side plate bearing that fails first, not the left spool bearing.  why?  i dunno.......

james, you may have to spend a little time to get these reels dialed in.  first, i would pull the non-spool bearings and repack them with yamaha marine grease.  second, don't push them too hard.  by the time this is all said and done, you should be able to rebuild these in your sleep.  hey, maybe you'll find a new hobby!

be interested in your evaluation on the inox products.esp;mx5 cheers