Daiwa Coastal 153H 'sticky' drag?

[jplee3]

Hey all,

I had put some carbontex washers in my beat-up 153H but just haven't really used it much. One thing I've noticed about it though is that it's pretty 'bumpy' when I button down the drag towards max. I don't know if this is stickiness or not but it's definitely not that smooth.

I've taken the reel apart a few times made sure to wipe off the old grease, reapplying Cal's and then wiping off the excess. Unless I'm just not doing that part right or there's still too much grease in there, I'm not sure what else could be wrong.

Anyone have an idea what might be causing the sticky/bumpy feeling towards max drag?

[ReelClean]

How do the metal drag washers look?  Flat, discolored, are the ears torn up or hanging up in the main gear?

[jplee3]

How do the metal drag washers look?  Flat, discolored, are the ears torn up or hanging up in the main gear?

The metal drag washers seem fine. They are flat and not discolored, and ears not torn or anything. For good measure I took some fine sandpaper and sanded them down a bit.

[ReelClean]

The only other thing I have seen is the key in the drag washer (the double "D" shape) got opened out. so that the round washer chewed into the mainshaft and then when you applied drag the washer kinda rode up the scores in the shaft instead of staying in the maingear.  Bit hard to explain but look for the washer rounded out with bent/twisted ID and helical scoring/grooving on the shaft just above where the maingear sits.
cheers
Steve

[jplee3]

The only other thing I have seen is the key in the drag washer (the double "D" shape) got opened out. so that the round washer chewed into the mainshaft and then when you applied drag the washer kinda rode up the scores in the shaft instead of staying in the maingear.  Bit hard to explain but look for the washer rounded out with bent/twisted ID and helical scoring/grooving on the shaft just above where the maingear sits.
cheers
Steve

Thanks! I'm not sure what the "Double D shape" washer is you're referring to... can you call out the # per the schematic (http://www.daiwa.com/us/service/manuals/image/baitcasting/CL153H.pdf) ? 

Ahh wait I think I may have a guess - is it the top-most metal drag washer (part #74 in the diagram)? And you're saying to check to see if the inside hole has opened up and is riding up on the gear shaft collar (#75) and possibly the roller clutch (#76)?

[ReelClean]

Close, parts 63 and 72.  72 rounds out and doesn't lock in to the main shaft but spins past it's place and rides up or turns past and locks itself onto, but out of position, on the shaft.  The drag stack can't slip freely up and down the shaft so you get some weird behaviour.  If you look at the washer you can see the metal displaced in the corners of the "D" and that allows the washer to turn out of it's position.

[jplee3]

Close, parts 63 and 72.  72 rounds out and doesn't lock in to the main shaft but spins past it's place and rides up or turns past and locks itself onto, but out of position, on the shaft.  The drag stack can't slip freely up and down the shaft so you get some weird behaviour.  If you look at the washer you can see the metal displaced in the corners of the "D" and that allows the washer to turn out of it's position.

Hmm, I checked 72 out but it doesn't seem like anything's wrong. The metal corners seem OK and it is 'locked' onto the shaft in that it can't spin around at all.

[ReelClean]

OK, does the drag "bottom out" suddenly or does the drag pressure gradually ramp up?  I am thinking maybe another washer under the drag star to make sure the star is not bottoming out before the drag locks up?  Have you measured the height of the new stack versus the old?

[jplee3]

OK, does the drag "bottom out" suddenly or does the drag pressure gradually ramp up?  I am thinking maybe another washer under the drag star to make sure the star is not bottoming out before the drag locks up?  Have you measured the height of the new stack versus the old?

The pressure gradually does ramp up I think. Which part/area would you potentially place another washer under the drag star? One of the belleville (?) ones? I tossed the old washers years ago upon upgrading to carbontex, and didn't think to check the stack height or anything.

I suppose I should also grab a scale and put the reel on a rod to check the drag pressure too I guess. Is there a way to measure it with a scale directly off the reel?

[ReelClean]

Any washer that fits under the star and around the mainshaft, just trying to preload the drag stack a bit more to see how it behaves as it ramps up.  The carbontex is not overgreased?  All the bearings on the mainshaft/spool serviceable? The preload spacers in the LHS sideplate (6,7) are in place so that the spool is centred and isn't interfering with the frame? If everything is flat and true as you say then short of something like a shaft being bent I am running out of ideas.

[jplee3]

Any washer that fits under the star and around the mainshaft, just trying to preload the drag stack a bit more to see how it behaves as it ramps up.  The carbontex is not overgreased?  All the bearings on the mainshaft/spool serviceable? The preload spacers in the LHS sideplate (6,7) are in place so that the spool is centred and isn't interfering with the frame? If everything is flat and true as you say then short of something like a shaft being bent I am running out of ideas.

Hmm, just took it apart again and reinspected things - it seems at least one of the eared washers is *slightly* bent? It's very slight from what I can see and pretty tough to notice. But I'm assuming it being even slightly bent could be the cause of the symptoms I'm hitting?

[ReelClean]

It would be worthwhile getting yourself a small sheet of glass, a few sheets of wet/dry sandpaper, wet or oil it and get to work and see if you can flatten and lap that washer.

[jplee3]

It would be worthwhile getting yourself a small sheet of glass, a few sheets of wet/dry sandpaper, wet or oil it and get to work and see if you can flatten and lap that washer.

I was checking the drag again and it actually feels pretty smooth pulling line through if I pull it through the level wind. If I pull from the top without the level wind I feel the bumpiness. If I button down the drag really hard (likely beyond what is supported), I really start feeling the reel get jerky but I assume at that point I should know the drag is set too high. Is it pretty 'normal' for lighter-weight reels to respond this way when/if buttoning the drag down close to their max-drag point?

The washer itself is relatively thin - I'm wondering if it would be worth while just to buy a couple replacement ear washers at this point. I was looking at updating my Saltist 30T frame with the 35BG to get the wider-positioned clamp legs so maybe I'll just order those all together next time I'm heading up towards Cypress...

[jplee3]

Quick update but since posting this I took the reel out and hooked up on a BIG halibut but it broke me off. Likely due to the bumpiness in the drag. I *think* what the issue might be is the eared washers - I put them against a flat surface (mirror) and on one side they *appear* flat but if I flip them over, place them against the mirror, then press on on edge of the washer the opposite side lifts. I'm guessing *this* is what is causing the issues. Even if I were to 'invert' the eared washers so that they're concave (?) against the main gear, it seems fruitless. Pulling line straight off through the levelwind when compared to my other baitcasters is not nearly as smooth - it's not 'sticky' but it feels like a bunch of "small bumps" if that makes sense. These eared washers are quite thin, but I'm not sure how they became concave like that. I'm guessing that's not expected and that these washers should be 100% flat with no lifting when placed on glass/mirror/truly flat surfaces.... ?