Quick 220 drag stack questions...

mo65 · January 31, 2020, 02:50:11 PM

Before you go any farther...post a pic of the entire drag stack. Place the parts in a line with the retaining ring on the left and the bottom washer on the right. We'll go from there.

Beachmaster · February 02, 2020, 12:45:06 AM

Here ya go Mo...

Gobi King · February 02, 2020, 03:54:35 PM

that does not look like what I have, I will crack mine open in a few, sorry, have been side tracked with sick kiddo.

mo65 · February 02, 2020, 03:56:02 PM

OK...it looks like whoever had this thing before you subbed in more Resistex to make up for the thickness of the missing #100 058 spring. I believe I would change it so all the Resistex is stacked under the keyed metal washer...with that keyed washer at the top of the stack.
I also just noticed on an earlier post you mentioned this:

Quote from: Beachmaster on January 29, 2020, 11:45:19 PM
I also think I have come to the conclusion that my ratchet under the bottom of the spool does not work. When I put all of the drags in and tighten down the drag, there is absolutely NO resistance whatsoever, the spool just turns freely in both directions easily.

Even with no drag washers at all in the spool that AR should still click. Check to see if the spool sleeve is locking into the axle correctly.

Alto Mare · February 02, 2020, 04:00:10 PM

That drag combination could never work, all washers would rotate giving a couple of pounds of drag... if that.
You might have a missing metal washer.
It doesn't make sense to me.

Sal

mo65 · February 02, 2020, 04:08:08 PM

Quote from: Alto Mare on February 02, 2020, 04:00:10 PM
That drag combination could never work, all washers would rotate giving a couple of pounds of drag... if that.
You might have a missing metal washer.
It doesn't make sense to me.

The keyed washer won't rotate...it's fixed to the sleeve. If you look at the schematic I posted earlier it makes more sense. It's confused by all the Resistex added to make up for the missing height of #100 058.

Jimmer · February 02, 2020, 04:18:58 PM

There does not appear to be an eared washer to transfer drag to the spool? - Jimmer

mo65 · February 02, 2020, 04:25:58 PM

Quote from: Jimmer on February 02, 2020, 04:18:58 PM
There does not appear to be an eared washer to transfer drag to the spool? - Jimmer

Correct...no eared washers in this setup. It's a very basic system, where the spool is "pinched" between the top keyed washer and the under spool washer. Some of the 270s used this system too.

Beachmaster · February 02, 2020, 07:37:26 PM

Quote from: mo65 on February 02, 2020, 03:56:02 PM
OK...it looks like whoever had this thing before you subbed in more Resistex to make up for the thickness of the missing #100 058 spring. I believe I would change it so all the Resistex is stacked under the keyed metal washer...with that keyed washer at the top of the stack.
I also just noticed on an earlier post you mentioned this:
Quote from: Beachmaster on January 29, 2020, 11:45:19 PM
I also think I have come to the conclusion that my ratchet under the bottom of the spool does not work. When I put all of the drags in and tighten down the drag, there is absolutely NO resistance whatsoever, the spool just turns freely in both directions easily.
Even with no drag washers at all in the spool that AR should still click. Check to see if the spool sleeve is locking into the axle correctly.

Mo, I did just what you said and no difference with anything. The AR does click. As far as I can tell the spool sleeve is locking in correctly. I found (5) of the #100 058 springs on Ebay and they should be here tomorrow or Tuesday. I am betting that this is the culprit?

Midway Tommy · February 02, 2020, 10:01:35 PM

Do you have the two correct washers between the spool and the spindle/ratchet wheel? It almost appears that maybe someone took those two and added them to the spool group when they lost or removed the spool coil spring.

mo65 · February 02, 2020, 10:12:07 PM

Quote from: Beachmaster on February 02, 2020, 07:37:26 PM
Mo, I did just what you said and no difference with anything. The AR does click. As far as I can tell the spool sleeve is locking in correctly. I found (5) of the #100 058 springs on Ebay and they should be here tomorrow or Tuesday. I am betting that this is the culprit?

From what I can see it just about has to be the culprit. That spring looks pretty thick...it would take a whole stack of washers to equal it's height...bet you'll get some "squeeze" happening now.

Beachmaster · February 02, 2020, 10:16:31 PM

Quote from: mo65 on February 02, 2020, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: Beachmaster on February 02, 2020, 07:37:26 PM
Mo, I did just what you said and no difference with anything. The AR does click. As far as I can tell the spool sleeve is locking in correctly. I found (5) of the #100 058 springs on Ebay and they should be here tomorrow or Tuesday. I am betting that this is the culprit?

From what I can see it just about has to be the culprit. That spring looks pretty thick...it would take a whole stack of washers to equal it's height...bet you'll get some "squeeze" happening now.

Yup. That's them. It looks like the 220 is the only one other than the 238 and the other models in that older line that use these springs.

Beachmaster · February 02, 2020, 10:19:38 PM

Quote from: Midway Tommy on February 02, 2020, 10:01:35 PM
Do you have the two correct washers between the spool and the spindle/ratchet wheel? It almost appears that maybe someone took those two and added them to the spool group when they lost or removed the spool coil spring.

Good question Tommy, I have only a thin resistex washer under the ratchet wheel (between the bottom of the spool and ratchet wheel) According to the schematic that Mo posted, which is the correct one for my reel, it would be parts #100 066 and #100 067 but I don't see a parts list explaining what those washers are supposed to be? Check that, looking at the one Fred posted it's part numbers #100 086 and #100 087 which is a resistex and a metal washer. So I will fix that and see if anything changes.

mo65 · February 02, 2020, 10:31:12 PM

Quote from: Beachmaster on February 02, 2020, 10:19:38 PM
Quote from: Midway Tommy on February 02, 2020, 10:01:35 PM
Do you have the two correct washers between the spool and the spindle/ratchet wheel? It almost appears that maybe someone took those two and added them to the spool group when they lost or removed the spool coil spring.
Good question Tommy, I have only a thin resistex washer under the ratchet wheel (between the bottom of the spool and ratchet wheel) According to the schematic that Mo posted, which is the correct one for my reel, it would be parts #100 066 and #100 067 but I don't see a parts list explaining what those washers are supposed to be? Check that, looking at the one Fred posted it's part numbers #100 086 and #100 087 which is a resistex and a metal washer. So I will fix that and see if anything changes.

Good point Tom...I forgot to mention the under spool washers. And you're right Beachmaster, that schematic doesn't list those washers, but they are a thin Resistex and a thin brass washer.

Beachmaster · February 02, 2020, 10:37:38 PM

Aaaaaannnnd...we have SUCCESS!! It was the damn washers under the ratchet wheel! I put the resistex directly under the spool and the brass on top of resistex against the ratchet wheel and it worked! Albeit, not a lot of drag range but WAY better than what it was and it will tighten down to where I have to apply a pretty darn good effort to turn the spool. I bet when I get that spring in the drag stack it will be back to normal!

My only issue, not a big one but a bothersome one is trying to figure out where this darn scrapping sound is coming from. I can't find anywhere on this spool where there are indications that it is scraping anything in the rotor housing...?

I am going to have to learn how these darn drags work. Keyed washers, resistex, CF, metal washers, etc. I feel like this is the only system on reels that I just don't understand how they work yet.

To all who have posted and helped figure this out...Y'ALL ARE THE BEST!