Improved line lay and the future of spinning reel gearing.

[nelz]

How does it feel when cranking with a load on the line ,can you feel the lobes change over through the crank handle  ?

Feels no different than round gears.

Just a quick note relating to Hawks comments, I agree that other designs can also lay line just as evenly. But this reel also casts extraordinarily well and it does not dig in under pressure, I believe it's from the pattern it lays the line in.

[nelz]

HA! Could be. Mine is one shelfie out of four different spinners, box, paperwork and all. I reviewed the stuff A.K. Left-out of his. Too much plastic composite, albeit uniquely designed and engineered.

It certainly has many ingenious and sophisticated design features, but like you said way "too much plastic". I also find it so clunky and awkward in shape, I mean, who wants an anti-reverse switch that big?      And that tiny spool in relation to the size of the reel?

It's a great investment reel though if you get it at a good price!

[Midway Tommy]

Q: What's the world's most over-rated reel? A: Suveran     

There are many who would argue that but, hey, everyone is welcome to an opinion. 

[jurelometer]

HA! Could be. Mine is one shelfie out of four different spinners, box, paperwork and all. I reviewed the stuff A.K. Left-out of his. Too much plastic composite, albeit uniquely designed and engineered.

It certainly has many ingenious and sophisticated design features, but like you said way "too much plastic". I also find it so clunky and awkward in shape, I mean, who wants an anti-reverse switch that big?      And that tiny spool in relation to the size of the reel?

It's a great investment reel though if you get it at a good price!

Nothing wrong with plastic when used correctly. The ambassador levelwinds are full of plastic, but since the plastic is mostly on the inside, nobody complains.   

The actual drive housing body of the Surevan seems quite small to me, especially for a 5:1 worm drive reel.  I read that they used the same body size for all models, so it may make a difference which model you are looking at.   And the minimal number of parts for the drive train, especially the oscillation is impressive.  This is a long spool reel in the era of short spools.  The main gear shaft is supported on both sides in a single piece of solid forged aluminum. The handle design appears well thought out. Both look better to me than  anything that I have seen on modern era reels, although I am not a spinner-junky myself.

Having said that, I do agree that there is a bit of weirdness dimension-wise.  I think that it comes from the humongous drag capsule.  Maybe they were trying to protect the drag, but the capsule pushes the spool away from the body, requiring a larger rotor assembly.  And I agree that the giant anti reverse ring is not attractive, or probably necessary.

IMHO, you could make a modern version of this reel using some different design choices to eliminate the drag capsule, and have a pretty cool reel.  The winding load capability will always be a bit limited due to the worm/pawl oscillation design, but you can't get rid of this without fundamentally changing the reel, and winding under load is only going to be an issue when you get into much larger saltwater reels. 

I don't get the affection that you folks have for glorified eggbeaters spinning reels, but I do respect thoughtful design.  It is nearly always much harder to design something with  the same functionality, but with much fewer parts.  In that regard, you have to give the Surevan some respect.  It has to have the fewest parts of a long spool spinner. It is the hack designers that keep adding parts until the device is properly functional.  If you look at the most revered spinners that have stood the test of time, the designs are usually deceptively simple.

Q: What's the world's most over-rated reel? A: Suveran     

There are many who would argue that but, hey, everyone is welcome to an opinion. 

I would have bet the answer was the Stella.  Or maybe something from Accurate

 -J

[foakes]

Q: What's the world's most over-rated reel? A: Suveran     

I would likely say —- nearly any spinning reel manufactured after 1990 —- regardless of claims, price, or bling.

Then, I also think that one of the most beloved reels of all time is grossly over-rated —- Mitchell 300.

Popular, great looking reel —- but when the numerous alloy gears inside the case start to degenerate with heavy fishing pressure, the A/R won't catch to stop the gear ratchet, the shims wear out, and the crank bends under pressure —- well, you get the picture.

And this is not just my opinion —- there are likely 300 of these reels out in crates in the upper storage —- and they all tell a similar story.

Suveran is a fine reel, possibly one of the best.

Best, Fred

[oldmanjoe]

     I don't get the affection that you folks have for glorified eggbeaters spinning reels, but I do respect thoughtful design.  It is nearly always much harder to design something with  the same functionality, but with much fewer parts. 
 


Mitchel has some strange gear drives , I prefer the simple style less parts and gets the job done

[DougK]

never understood why Mitchell stopped making the Planamatic gearing.. use my 1974 Mitchell 308 with modern braid and it lays the braid better than most modern reels..

[jurelometer]

never understood why Mitchell stopped making the Planamatic gearing.. use my 1974 Mitchell 308 with modern braid and it lays the braid better than most modern reels..

Oooh... planetary gearing for the oscilator.  Just when you think there are no more ways left to skin that cat!

Looks to me like the planamatic system enables more than one oscilation per main gear/handle rotation, which a standard scotch yoke style crosswind setup cannot do.  But the nested gears means that the crosswind gear has to be small, so the the crosswind pin does not have much horizontal travel. Which means that the spool has to be fairly narrow.  Would be tough to get it to work with a modern spinner with a longer spool.  Also doesn't look that durable for winding under heavier load.  For the reels that the planamatic system was in, the tradeoffs might have worked out, but I could see how it would be difficult to carry forward into modern reel designs that might demand longer spools and more load capacity.

Curious how those planamatics held up with extended use.

-J

[DougK]

Curious how those planamatics held up with extended use.

mine was my primary spinning reel for several decades, fished several times a week. Now I'm down to only once every couple of weeks sadly. Also used it for light saltwater in estuaries a number of times. Biggest fish were catfish up to 20lb, carp to 15lb. It's fine ;-)

Good point about spool size, though.

[JasonGotaProblem]

Re: worm oscillation spinners with minimal # of parts: if memory serves daiwa ss700 has the same total # of pieces (counting every screw and washer individually) as a penn senator. The line lay is razor straight and the casting distance is absurd.

But it's got a graphite body so some folks wont give it the time of day.

[Midway Tommy]

But it's got a graphite body so some folks wont give it the time of day.

I don't blame them. I don't mind graphite spools, I use them all the time on my black ABU Garcia fulcrum brake reels and have never had a single problem but you couldn't give me graphite body reel no matter who it's made by.