Zeus 4 findings.

[Cor]

Nice looking fish!

About a year ago I took a 25 lb rod, turned the tip around and angled 2 of the guides to the left to create an acid wrapped rod as an experiment.
I have it paired with a Penn Fathom FTH 25N.   I have caught a few fish on it but what I really wanted to see was how it casts.

The rod cast superbly, its only about 8ft 6 and pulls fish well.   Can't say if any better then in its old coat but most certainly I won't change it.

[gstours]

Sorry about being late to reply.  As my spiral rods have evolved I've been kinda doing my own experiments with the first couple of guides....   I prefer to have the stripper closer to the grip and centered atop the blank, and yes do put the second guide to the right in order to lay the line on the reel in the middle,  then make the transition to the left fairly quickly to get more of the below the blank guides their maximum ability to make the difference.
  Asap I'll post pictures of some of my work.  These rods are out on the boat currently. 
  Stay around also as I've nearly finished my custom 16 hi x 8 offset stripper guide that I mentioned earlier.   It's going to be killer......

[gstours]

Here's a picture of the idea. Using the graduation of several guide rings to make a transition from 16mm=10mm-8mm.   Also the rings can now be horizontally offset to aid in keeping the incoming line on the spool central.
  I know it's a crazy idea,  from a crazy person.

[gstours]

Ok, I'm back.  Anyway the pieces were added one at a time, using devcon 5 min epoxy.
  The center of the small guide has been off set, this may keep the incoming line laying in the center of the spool with almost no attention?
  This might eliminate offset on the next guide to accomplish the same thing?
The halibut with the dark side up was taken with the Zeus 4,  the white side up fish was taken on a conventional jig rod, Trevalla.   
  It's quite possible that the guides might mutate from the top to the bottom of the rod in another spiral effort.🎣
  Shimano puts the stripper quite a bit from the fore grip,  maybe for casting? 

[oldmanjoe]

     I like that idea that you did with that guide

[boon]

Does it make much difference though, I wonder? On the stripper the line is pretty constrained by the next guide and the reel anyway, I suspect the variance in angle from that guide is basically the same regardless of the size. It's not like it has to deal with loops coming off a spinning reel.

[gstours]

Tanks mr. Boon,  thi idea has several components, one is to center for oncoming line, and with a 12- 16+ size ring it must be in an exaggerated position to the offset to allow the larger diameter ring to work as an equivalent.....
  Also I. In desire of a taller guide coming off the reel than a standard 8-10 casting guide hence the development.     
   Anyway it's at almost no cost if a person has the components anyway.....🎣

[JasonGotaProblem]

Very interesting idea. I'll admit that I didn't quite get what you were planning when you first previewed the idea. But I love what you came up with. I feel like taller double foot guides are the next wave of products fuji should release. They've got a size 30 KW in 2 different heights. Why not a size 16?

[steelfish]

They've got a size 30 KW in 2 different heights. Why not a size 16?

maybe not in KW guide, but fuji already has the same model Gary is using on a 16M and even 12M , which are taller than normal 16 and 12, maybe not as taller as the 20 but mostly depends on what you are trying to achieve without re-inventing the wheel.

Gary is a mad-scientist  (with all due respect) so, I  try to see what hes trying to get from them, looks like NZ rod builders just got the desired line path to the reel adding a second bumper guide in the same straight 0* axis or bit 5*axis and USA builders skipped this line path problem and just build the spiral wrap on a revolver style (with some degrees more o less depending on the rod builder), other wanted those same results as Gary just installing the stripper guide on a 5* axis and then the rest of the guides spiraled to the left.

[gstours]

Alex, and all.  Notice that the height of the guide is the basis, and the small ring will now keep the incoming line at the bottom I/4 left of center.  This is closer to the center of the guide Than if it guide was a 12-16 size as you remember the incoming line of the spiral wrap is forced to the lower 1/4 side and not centered as assumed on a conventional rod.   
  The smaller the guide in this application will help keep the incoming line centered on the reel if its kept level.  When reeling in a fish with much side load on the rod the line always follows the loading some.
  Lastly I did slightly make the smaller guide offset in the parent guide some .  This might not be a measure able benefit,  butt I could.   
  I'm planning a Zeus 3 spiral 🌀 eventually.   Stay tuned.  

[steelfish]

Gary, is the 2nd guide a bit tilted to the right and then the transition to the left or its straight at 0* as is the striper guide?

I might go this route following the Jigstar rods Twisted sista model style on my Zeus 3, worst scenario is I didnt liked it and just re-wraped it.

already on the works with the Zeus 3 Gary, just in case you want to check the deflection tests, I will make one with 5#, but as you already noticed, this blanks are not tipped
https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=35112.new#new

[gstours]

In my first z4 the first guide was centered on the rod.  Butt the large diameter of its ring was deminished to half size by inserting a smaller size into it and epoxy it ,  it was centered in the tall first guide.
  My findings are that by offsetting the smaller insert guide towards the direction you need to keep the oncoming line in the center of the reel is andwantagous, ..
New word, ?  Maybe not. .
 We want everything we can get, right?   
   My z4 does that well.  But I'm waiting to do a few things different on next year's z3.  Let's learn as we do and have fun in the mean while,   Eating fish 🐠

[sabaman1]

Gary, should the guides spiral left or right on a right handed reeling conventional acid wrapped rod?

[gstours]

It might have to be up to your preference actually,  as how you mending the incoming line.  Some people prefer to push it over one way than the other.
  Just my humble opinion.  My transition guides rotate to the left with a right hand reel.   
 Also some spiral 🌀 wrap rods might just lay the line to one side of the spool 🧵, more than desired,  this might be adjusted/remedied by moving the center of the first guide,  in my opinion.   I,m not an expert, nor can I just leave anything alone.