My adventure in soldering rings.....

[oc1]

Small imperfections can be cleaned up with a conical pink grinding stone on a dremel tool  Start with a pink stone and finish with a white stone.  You can then use a red rouge polishing compound on a cotton buffing bit to give it a nice shine.  You will also need one of those little dremel dressing blocks to occasionally grind the solder out of the pours in the stones and renew the abrasive surface.

It's tedious to do for large imerfections so it's easier and faster to just start over with improved alignment and soldering technique.

[jurelometer]

A mini butane torch gets the braze area hot enough in seconds and has a nice concentrated flame.  With my mapp torch, I'm going to burn all the paint off my jig if I don't melt it first.  Maybe  if I had one of those mini torch setups with an oxygen blend...

-J

[pjstevko]

In the spirt of learning I decided to film 3 attempts at soldering a couple rings. I uploaded the videos to yt for your viewing pleasure and critique. The first one I think turned out the best and passed the twist test.  The next two I did I used thicker rings and they failed the twist test and I think it's because I applied the solder when the ring metal wasn't hot enough.  Please watch the videos and let me know how I can improve my soldering.

Attached are pics of the rings and flux applications.

Video links

https://youtu.be/HzErGYpOZXs?si=5pTeS0vEt8nWZDTL

https://youtu.be/VqHfXKF6iB4?si=CNOtUGmiF6zOhZAw

https://youtu.be/1fe74YccniY?si=AYrqmqOnUOGddudN

[alantani]

very nice work.  mapp gas?

[pjstevko]

very nice work.  mapp gas?

no, butane torch

[Keta]

It always thought MAPP gas flame was hotter than butane and propane, I looked it up and was wrong. I have a small oxacetylene torch that burns considerably hotter and the tips are much better than my butane torch.  Unfortunatly I sold my acetylene and oxygen bottles several years ago....:0( MAPP gas should work better for the smaller rings.

Butane 3578°F
MAP 3600°F
Propane 3560°F
Oxacetylene 5600°F to 6300°F

[jurelometer]

Looks like too much flux to me. In the first, the flux cooks down properly and you can see the actual ring when you add the solder.  In the second and third, you are putting the solder over the flux, and probably trapping some flux inside the joint.

Just a small amount of flux, only where you want the solder to go, and put the solder on the gap, not on one side of it.

Regarding butane vs other torches, my inexpensive butane mini gets the ring red in a couple seconds, and has a nice pinpoint flame when adjusted tight.  It has two adjustments, one for gas volume and one for air blend. 

-J

[Keta]

What brand is it, air adjustment might be nice to have

[jurelometer]

What brand is it, air adjustment might be nice to have

Blazer ES1000.

[Keta]

Thank you.

[gstours]

Thanks fellas on your sharing info.  I still am learning in the ring thing.  Just like a dummy ive sold a nice small aceta/oxy torch set perfect for what it could do with any size rings.  This set up soldered ribs and sights on guns and repairs to rifle bolt knobs and other things.  Moving Alaska i knew acetalene would be very costly to obtain in my remote site away from the road system i have struggled with welding rings ever since.
  The temp. of flame types are good info.  The area away from the tip of the flame is colored with different shades and colors.  This is important to pay attention to .   Even now i am reminded that the hotter temps of a flame is out at the outer part of the tapered burning, even out more. 
  Some one here can chime in on the technical wording butt its worth noting,  its out further away from the flame colors where the heat is the hottest and more pure from oxygen contaminates.    gst.

[Keta]

The tip of the blue flame is the hottest part of a oxacetylene flame.

[jurelometer]

Brazing rings for hooks and lures requires heating just a small amount of metal, just where the braze is going to go ideally.  A good mini butane will provide up to 2500F of heat, which is over twice as hot as you want the ends of the ring to get.

From the product instructions, it sounds like you want to heat to the liquidous phase of the braze, which for 56% silver is 1200F. 

Looking at the color charts for heating steels, 1200 is a cherry red.  A bright red is getting past 1500.  If you are getting into the oranges, you are close to pushing past the published limit of the fluxes.

Looks to me like we are going way too hot in the videos. With the right amount of flux, that black Harris flux should turn clear as it approaches silver brazing temp. Hold the brazing wire really close to the zone, ready to go, but not close enough to melt.  Touch straight into to the gap, and it will fill the gap first and the spread to both  ends of the flux.

More heat is not better. A pinpoint torch is a better torch that a hotter torch for this job.

As I mentioned before, my better brazes happened when I didn't screw up and shoot past the desired heat range.  Come to think of it, I should probably just practice hitting the perfect temp, rather than be pleasantly surprised when it happens I really should be better at this by now.

The flux is pretty nasty stuff healthwise, You don't want to handle it, or breath the fumes when brazing.  The instructions recommend a well ventilated area and away from food and drink- wash your hands afterwards, but there are videos of folks doing this on their kitchen table next to a beer- yikes.  I saw a video from a professional welder, and he was doing his rings outdoors.  That probably tells us something. 

Here is the SDS for the Harris black flux that many of us are using:

https://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/US/EN/MSDS_lib/ZLE_SDS_NA-EN-200000007165.pdf

Even us layman can follow the last part of section 8 (EXPOSURE CONTROLS / PERSONAL PROTECTION)

-J

[Keta]

Thanks for the MSDS link.

You do not want to melt the solder with the flame, it should melt when you touch it to the joint.  Pre heat the solder as you heat the ring.

[pjstevko]

I put new rings and a hook on a small surface iron today. I think these turned out great!