Help identifying old Montague split bamboo saltwater rod?

[Kenkeay]

Hi all:
Does anyone have any information on a Montague split bamboo saltwater fishing rod I think is an "Offshore" model? When produced, intended use, etc?

I found what I think is one in a lot of vintage gear that reportedly was found in basement ceiling joists after a house purchase, according to the seller.

The rod is about 8' 10" long, and is fairly slender for its length.  A guess from the length and reasonably lightweight construction is that it was intended as a surfcaster.

It is in apparently reasonably good condition, but there is one feature that confuses me.   I can't see any sign it came from the maker with more than the rod tip as a line guide.  A previous owner had kluged two guides along the length with electrical tape at some point (one was missing when I bought it) but there are no marks in the finish I that I would expect to see if wrapped guides had ever been present.  I'm probably missing something obvious* but don't know what.

I carefully removed multiple layers of electrical and friction tape that covered 16" of the rod above the handle. Removing the tape and adhesive residues let me find the label, and after a brief search I found a rod in an online sales listing identified as a Montague saltwater boat rod with the same logo,  with "dreadnought" on the label and identified as the model.  If so then my rod might be an "offshore".

Also, are there any online guides or forums or other resources that will help me learn to conserve the rod?    After removing the tape residue, I found the tape was added to bind a partial delamination in the 6 bamboo laths.  I want to restore it the best I can but have not worked in wooden rods before. 
Thanks everyone.

Ken

*After cleaning, the finish under the tape shows similar wear and imperfections as the finish on the exposed length does.  The only thing that comes to mind would be for an owner to do a high quality sanding and refinishing of the entire rod blank, erasing scars from any original guide wraps, then stop before reinstalling new guides.  Then years later, they or a later owner go nuts with the tape, a completely different level of rod care.     Seems possible but???

[Benni3]

You could look on ebay for more info on the rod and might be the exact one there,,,, the prices have gone up a little,,,i can't wait to see it back in shape and you fishing it,,,,,,

[oc1]

That's a cool old rod.  The first decision may be whether or not you want to fish with it.  Delamination is pretty serious.  It's not surprising when you consider the glues available at the time.  To fix delamination you would need to inject a low viscosity glue or epoxy and then tightly bind that area until it dries.  But even with the delamination fixed, the entire rod is going to be very brittle because all the oils from the bamboo have disappeared.  If it were mine I'd remove all the tape, remove the black paint and clean it up enough for display while preserving the honest patina.  Then put it on the wall.

The Mildrum-style tip-top and guides are probably post-war and not original to the rod.  The originals could have been Agate or Agatine with one guide on the top and another guide directly below it.  If so, the tip-tip would swivel so it could be used with either guide by turning the rod at the ferrule so the reel seat would align.  But, that's all speculation.

You're probably right about it being a surf rod.  I think the rod length might be the best clue for pinpointing the model and vintage.  8' 10" is an unusual enough length to narrow it down significantly.  The shape of the wood turning on the handle will help too.

Montage was making split bamboo rods for a very long time (roughly 1882 until just after the Second World War), the offerings changed frequently, and they didn't use model numbers.  The only place you might find a complete set of catalogs would be over at ORCA (Old Reel Collectors Association.

Best of luck with the search.

[Kenkeay]

Thanks.  I'll try the O.R.C.A. website.  While I try to fish with the vintage reels I restore, I think this rod is destined as a wallhanger.  I'd hate to devote tens of hours in restoration and possibly the price of agate rod guides only to have brittle bamboo snap when a striper hit it.  Now if I only had a clear stretch of wall big enough (Sigh).

[Benni3]

The rod is cool,,,   but not rare,,,I got 1 at a yard sale $35 almost mint but the stamp,,,,,

[Benni3]

I got a 1907 ? Bamboo the only one a have found online is in a museum,, restored it and fished it,,,bamboo has a special feel not like graphite or fiberglass that's why you might see a new bamboo fly rod for $5000,,,,

[the rockfish ninja]

Hi Kenkeay, I restored a Montague Rapidan, here's a thread i posted on it.

https://alantani.com/index.php/topic,11230.msg108342.html#msg108342
Not a step by step tutorial, just a before/after.

There are forums/websites on the subject that I found when doing this project but they didn't have much in the way of instructional info so I had to trial by fire.

Here's some tips I learned myself.

- Don't use sandpaper, the abrasive can thin & weaken the blank. I stripped layers of old built up varnish with: a plastic putty spreader (soft & flexible enough not to cut into the bamboo), paint thinner, fine steel wool, & my finger nail.

- Cover the decal logo with paper, then tape, so no adhesive gets on it when you work on it.

- Learn how to Tiger Wrap guides.
 

Good luck with it.

[JasonGotaProblem]

Put some hooks and hang it from the ceiling if you don't have wall space. It's almost like an homage to the condition it was stored in for the past century.

[ExcessiveAngler]

Here's a beauty down in Connecticut!

[oldmanjoe]

    I had a lot of bookmarks at one time .  A lot of them are now 404 error.  I will post the ones that might help .   https://bamboo-rod-works.com/rod-identification.html
     https://classicflyrodforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=102790
https://classicflyrodforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=51463

https://splitcaneinfo.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/Montague-1939.pdf  This has saltwater rods listed .

Titebond 3 is what I use to reglue joints . I also use boiled linseed oil to cleanup the sticks and putback oil in the bamboo .
Some  history   https://pelhamhs.org/documents/Flyrods/HoraceGray&Son_Fishing_Rod_FactoryOCR.pdf

[JasonGotaProblem]

I have one similar to the one EA posted slated to arrive Friday. It's "6 pieces" at least 2 of which are tips. Stay tuned.

[Kenkeay]

Thanks, everyone:

The hot muggies put a damper on my rod restoring activities, but I hope to return to it in a few weeks if the air dries out.  If I make substantial progress I will post before and after photos. 

Thanks for all of the ideas. 

Ken