alan tani @ alantani.com fishing reel repair rebuild tutorial Pro Gear's PG251 and PG255, and Penn's Jigmaster 505HS and 506HS
Reel Repair by Alan Tani
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Author Topic: Pro Gear's PG251 and PG255, and Penn's Jigmaster 505HS and 506HS  (Read 48410 times)
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Bryan Young
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« on: January 07, 2011, 09:06:57 PM »

Well, today, Alan looked at my Pro Gear 251.  It's essentially a small, aluminum reel with guts like a Jigmaster.  To his discovery, someone (I bought the reel used) had changed the guts to a Penn Jigmaster.  The main gear was a high gear and Alan wondered is we could convert the drags from a 3+1 to a 5+1.  We took out the HT-100s, and Alan selected 5 Carbontex drag washers (I think they are the ones used for Abus) and also thin stainless steel metal washers also from SmoothDrag.  (Dimensions will follow).  I had to sand out the inner diameter to fit the OD of the new stainless gear sleeve.  Well, it work.  We were able to get 18# of drag, but the spool or spool shaft started to flex where the spool was rubbing the frame.  We backed it off and was able to get 12 of drag without the spool rubbing.  Anything higher caused the spool to rub.  This will be my deckhand rod reel for albies (if they ever come in close for me to try it out).

I was very impressed with the reel flexing without permanent warping.  Reel freespools awesome.

For those who don't know, the Pro Gear 251 is a wider Pro Gear 255.  We believe that the Pro Gear 255 should be able to get 15# of drag without the  spool rubbing in this configuration since the ability for spool to flex would be lessened with a narrower spooled reel.

Something worth considering if you want to upgrade your drags on your Pro Gear 251, 255, or Jigmaster 505..

Pics will follow as well.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 02:46:15 AM by Bryan Young » Logged

Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2011, 09:55:55 PM »

Here's the drag configuration:



Here is the SmoothDrag Configuration:

     Five #18 Carbontex, 0.5 mm thick (Center was bored out to 11 mm ID)
     Three Keyed Washers, 0.9 mm thick
     Two Eared Washers, 0.9 mm thick



The original washers were:
     Three HT-100s, 0.8 mm thick
     Two Keyed Washers, 1.06 mm thick
     One Eared Washer, 1.06 mm thick
     One Bevelled Spring Washer



The new SmoothDrag configuration should fit in the normal jigmaster main gear with the remaining 2 washers (keyed and carbontex) sitting above the edge of the main gear.  This will not be an issue since the eared washer is engaging the main gear.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2011, 10:01:44 PM by BryanYoung » Logged

Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2011, 11:11:08 PM »

Yeeeeessssssssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

Thank you, Bryan! That's what I want to do [1+5 drag] with my Jigmaster 500, Newell 220, and potentially a Penn 112H. I had figured the Carbontex #21 x 0.5mm washers would go in without modification, though.  Huh? Huh?
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Rob

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« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2011, 11:36:43 PM »

Awe, you mean that I missed the mark?  Oh well, the #18s work more than I need.  this is the story behind it.

I brough over my PG251 to upgrade to a stainless gear sleeve.  Then, Alan said, too bad that it wasn't a 5 + 1 stack.  I said, could it be?  And we went searching in his drag and metal washer boxes to see what we could come up with.  We discovered that I can actually put a 5 stack replacing the Penn 3 stack.  It was a great discovery.  

Alan said that the thinner metal washers are from Dawn (SmoothDrag).  So, that's the short story.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2011, 11:52:53 PM by BryanYoung » Logged

Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2011, 02:16:16 AM »

don't forget, a regular jigmaster/112h main gear will not work.  you need the jigmaster 505 main and pinion gear combo because the 505 main gear has a higher lip.  also, the 505 pinion gear has a smaller hole and has to be drilled out to accomodate the larger spool shaft in the jigmaster 500 and senator 112h spools.  

ugghhhhh!  2:20AM the my wife's father is just now going to bed.  poor guy can barely walk and it's my night to watch him.  
« Last Edit: January 10, 2011, 02:20:50 AM by alantani » Logged

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« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2011, 07:39:56 AM »

Thanks for the clarification on that Alan and Bryan. Maybe Dawn will put together 5-stack washer packages for all of the wackos like us who feel the need to obsessively take apart and rebuild our already finely-tuned reels. Huh?  What do you think Dawn? Grin Kiss Grin
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Rob

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« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2011, 09:02:16 AM »

We were looking for a 4:1 jigmaster gear yesterday afternoon to see what we could do for the narrower jigmaster gear.  I think its possible if you grind down the metal washers to 0.5 mm thick, but without a main gear to play with...  Let me take some additional measurements and see what I come up with.
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Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2011, 09:10:23 AM »

I've got a 4:1 main gear sitting on my bench from when I put the Newell 5:1 gears in. I could mail it to Alan. From my measurements, the top metal washer and maybe part of the top CF washer should be all that sits above the top of the main gear.
Rob
« Last Edit: January 10, 2011, 09:45:09 AM by norcal pescador » Logged

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« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2011, 12:59:56 PM »

the 5:1 newell will most likely not work.  it should have the same dimensions as the 4:1 penn.  it is only the 5:1 penn that has the extra "lip."  sorry. Undecided
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« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2011, 09:54:01 PM »

The 505 main gear drag depth is 7 mm (0.275").

Althought it is possible for you to get a 5+1 drag stack with a lot of elbow grease in grinding down the metal washers, realistically, you may exceed the drag range for the jigmaster, and thereby, you will probably shred your gears and damage other components.  I guess we discovered that with the Pro Gear 251 as well.  I'm not converting back though  Grin.
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Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2011, 12:03:51 AM »

Dawn of SmoothDrag has created sets for these reels, except she will be adding carbontex drag washer #21.  No boring of the washer is necessary.  The cost today is $31.50.  Give her a call and she will set you up.
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Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2011, 02:39:08 PM »

Got my kit yesterday from Dawn, thanks Dawn! Bryan I removed the old three set and put in the 5+1 today. Could barely attach the handle and could only get the star threaded about halfway on. Looked at the pictorial and noticed you had only one belleville. Opened it up and removed one of the two belleville washers. Reassembled and still too long, the spacer is almost covering all the star threads. There was very little wiggle room to tighten down the drag. Maybe a quarter turn at best, till fully buttoned. So, I guess I need to file down the spacer? The configuration looks exactly as shown in your pics. With the top fiber and metal keyed washer just above the lip and, the second eared washer flush at the top of the gear. Should I file the spacer down? I don't own a micrometer or calipers. So, measurment would be from a ruler only.

 
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« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2011, 03:13:30 PM »

You went against the adds with the 1+5 drag stack, you just added about 10lb. of pressure to a reel that wasn't designed for it. Anyways, shaving down the spacer sleeve is a good call and is just about all that you could do for now. Replace the belleville, shave the sleeve about a 16th of an inch and if you have the solid star wheel, place anothe belleville right under it, you might not need it dhough.You don't have to be too accurate shaving the sleeve, just get as close as you can, it will work for you. Be carefull on how you fish that reel, try not to fry your gears. Undecided
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« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2011, 04:27:24 PM »

If you look at the pics, my carbontex drag stack does not include the bevel.  It's not really needed anyway.  The pic with the bevel is the original drag stack.

If you want to keep the bevel, you will need to reduce the height of the spacer by the height of the bevel...also, I hope that there is sufficient clearance between the bevel and the frame.
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Cheesy I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. Cheesy
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« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2011, 05:57:43 PM »

Ok, Ok, I understand what it is that you are saying. Aren't the belleville washers there for a more gradual application of pressure to the drag stack? Moreover, don't they spread the pressure to the stack more evenly as they flatten out. As opposed to direct pressure to the stack from the center, generated by the force of the spacer, which only applies pressure on the inner most center of the stack? Then it would seem to diminish the benefit of the added washers, due to less pressure to the outer surface area, correct?

It is getting a little late here on the East coast. I don't want to dive in if I can't complete this tonight. So, I think it best that I wait till tomorrow. Otherwise I'll be up to two or three, tinkering, apart, together,
apart, together............... well you know.

I know it will fit with a belleville because that is how I have it now. But, like I said. it ramps up far too fast. Right now there is barely any graduation of drag pressure, I can't back off to zero lbs. That's for sure. If I had to guess it is at least eight lbs at the start. That may be due to the belleville getting squeezed as I tighten the bridge to the frame. At least that is what I've come up with thus far.

Your thoughts Bryan, anybody?
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