Oil ports

sdlehr · August 25, 2016, 10:10:33 PM

I get that Otto Henze patented the oil/grease/lubricant port(s) concept for Penn reels. But I don't get the utility of the oil port on the eccentric.... so you put oil through the port and it gets into the eccentric, then where does it go and what does it do? And how does that help anything?

Sid

RowdyW · August 25, 2016, 10:16:55 PM

There is a small hole in the side of the eccentric to lubricate the circumfrence of the eccentric. When I assemble a reel I always put a couple of drops of oil in there before installing the ecc. screw even though I greased it on installation.

sdlehr · August 25, 2016, 10:54:04 PM

Thanks, Rudy. I have 3 spare eccentrics in my parts bin - only one of the 3 has that hole. But not all Penn reels have oil ports on the eccentric, so I assume those that do not have no need for this hole. I always grease the outside circumference of the eccentric before I put it in the head plate also. It's really kind of an easy spot to get a drop of oil without the oil port.... I guess it's not the most important option on the reel.... and I guess Penn knew that because not all reels have this feature....

Sid

foakes · August 25, 2016, 10:58:55 PM

Rudy is right --

There is a "through hole" on the side of the eccentric -- for oil to do its work.

However, this is not always true -- since many of the Penns, particularly the average or smaller sizes -- do not have this side hole.

As a general rule, if there is an oil port in the free spool lever nut -- there will be a corresponding hole in the eccentric side.

That is providing all is original -- and has not been switched over the years.

When getting a Penn "salt ready" -- I just use a good marine lube like Yamaha liberally before inserting the eccentric and spring. In the field -- a drop or two of oil never hurts -- but if your reel is well maintained annually -- it should not be needed.

Best,

Fred

FatTuna · August 26, 2016, 03:41:24 AM

I never knew about the oiling port. You learn something new every day.

broadway · August 26, 2016, 11:00:17 AM

While we're on oil ports. Is it possible to replace and oil/grease/lubricant port in a side plate. I have an old plate that could use a new one pushed in but I need to get the old one out first... Any thoughts?
Thanks
Dom

sdlehr · August 26, 2016, 02:41:05 PM

Joe, I've had a few of those out. You can see the spring that retains it in a little slot on the inside circumerence of the gear well where the oil port is. You need a sharp instrument to start pulling on the spring (I use a dental pick) - you'll think its a slinky in there - and on the end of the spring is the little copper/brass nubbin that blocks the oil port. Sometimes the spring comes out without deforming. Sometimes not. I have reshaped the spring and had it fit back in and work just fine, but I don't handle this part often because 1) it's not necessary, solvents can clean that out, and 2) if it gets lost or destroyed a replacement might not be so easy to find.

Dom, let me know if this explanation is lacking and I can beef it up with some pictures. Basically, the spring lies in a little cut-out channel in the side plate; one end is blind, that's the spring end, and the little copper/brass blocker visible from the outside of the reel is on the other end, but you don't have access to either end so you have to remove it from the middle of the slot, first by pushing the spring all the way down so the free end is exposed and can be brought through the slot; then the rest just pulls right out.

Sid

PacRat · August 26, 2016, 03:55:15 PM

Dom,
I concur with Sid but try this first.
-Thoroughly clean any grease/oil residue with carb cleaner or similar solvent.
-Fill oil fitting with CLR or vinegar or similar to dissolve any salt or oxidation.
-Flush oil fitting with water to remove and neutralize CLR.
-Put light oil in oil fitting and manipulate detent and spring with the end of a paper clip.
I've fixed a couple this way.

Tightlines667 · August 26, 2016, 04:30:53 PM

I've wondered the same thing. I gotta believe anything is possible. Might need a perfectly sized roll pin punch in a press. I have a few old prewar reels in need of this repair. Handle knobs, and headplates if I remember correctly.

sdlehr · August 26, 2016, 05:06:41 PM

Quote from: Reel 224 on August 26, 2016, 04:55:51 PM
It seams like I completely misunderstood Dom's question. I thought he was saying to replace the fitting. Sid that sounds better for that part to be cleaned and maintained. I did not know that could be rebuilt like you have explained.

Thanks for that information.......Joe

Joe, now that I've read your comment and re-read Dom's question you may have been the one that read it right in the first place. We'll have to wait for Dom to find out. The piece you are talking about isn't replaceable as far as I know, it's molded into the head plate as you said originally.

Sid

Tightlines667 · August 26, 2016, 07:12:47 PM

I don't think these were molded into the sideplates. It would make more sense that they were pressed in after the bakelite was removed from the mold (just like some clicker ring retaining pins, and other parts. Due to the config. of most headplate oilers they can not be easily removed or replaced. They were pressed in from the outside, and would have to come out the same way. Handle knob oilers are typically pressed into the handle plastic, and marry to a brass/bronze sleeve. I think it might be possible to replace these. I guess in all cases a sacrifice would have to be made to get a suitable replacement oiler.

Interestingly, I have noticed differences in the retaining ring/spring config. On some of the very first/really old oilers.

All this is probably more trouble then it is worth.

However, I would love to see someone show us the way.

John

sdlehr · August 26, 2016, 08:08:42 PM

John, lets make sure we're talking about the same parts (I don't believe they appear on the Penn schematics). From the outside of the reel you can see the brass/bronze grommet intimately attached to the side plate. In the center of this is the spring-loaded plunger doo-hickey that seals the port under normal circumstances. Deep to this plunger is the spring that maintains the tension to keep the seal closed except when the plunger is disturbed to allow lubricant in. It is my belief that what I have called a grommet above, (maybe it really is a grommet) is made to be kept in place and not removed. It was an integral part of the side plate (and I think Joe brought this out). If it comes out you will likely have to do without it or replace the side plate. The spring-loaded plunger is easily removed from the head plate, but these are not the same as the oiler ports on the eccentric, the handle nut, the handle oiler, or either of the oiler fittings on the end caps. Those (I've not really gotten into them) appear to be easier with less spring mechanism required, but I haven't dug into the guts of any of those parts yet. As PacRAt said above, most of the time you can get these working well with solvents to remove the grease and CLR to remove the salts. The impatient way is to remove the spring and plunger and flush solvent through the port, then reassemble. It takes 2-3 minutes. Not the first time, more like 10 minutes. You always run the risk of damaging the spring and not having it return to its original position during reassembly.

Most of the time, thankfully, this is not an area we have to pay much attention to.

Sid

Tightlines667 · August 26, 2016, 09:43:42 PM

Sid,

We are talking about the same part. I don't think these are really worth trying to mess with disassembly or replacing 9 times out of 10. I was just saying I have a couple of old prewar reels, and I think Dom does too, that have missing oiler mechanisms... so the reels are not 100% complete/correct without actually replacing this part. I th8nk it can be done, but it may not be simple. I yavn'the attempted to replace a missing one yet myself.

sdlehr · August 26, 2016, 10:13:06 PM

John, its' a simple repair - but the parts have no numbers - If you want me to do the repairs I'd be happy to - but it may take me a while to locate replacements. Email me here with specific requests.

Sid

Tightlines667 · August 26, 2016, 11:06:09 PM

Sid,

I appreciate the offer. This project is on the back burner for awhile.. gonna be pretty busy with my new boat for awhile. Here is one of the reels, a first year Surfmaster 200, that needs the handle oiler replaced. I believe it requires one with a German silver cap. Probably easier to just find a replacement handle assembly.