alan tani @ alantani.com fishing reel repair rebuild tutorial cardinal 4 carbon fiber drag
Reel Repair by Alan Tani
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Author Topic: cardinal 4 carbon fiber drag  (Read 11968 times)
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handyandy
chasing smallmouth in southern indiana
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river smallmouth


« on: March 17, 2017, 05:45:04 AM »

I have a cardinal four and I wanted to try and improve the drag system by upgrading it to carbon fiber drag disc. To my knowledge no one makes a exact replacement set of carbon fiber drag disc for the cardinal 4's or any cardinal reels to the best of my knowledge. If I'm wrong I hope someone will speak up and post where they have gotten them. These did not work for me, but I figured I'd post up what I tried anyways. I started with carbontex drag disc meant for a sedona 4000 reel. I first drilled out the hole in the middle to fit a small bolt through to be able to chuck them in a drill to file them down to right circumference.


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handyandy
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« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2017, 05:47:35 AM »

Sorry I some how double posted this topic I will just continue on this one. After drilling out the hole on both disc I used a bolt and nut to hold them that I then put in the drill chuck. Used the drill to spin them and held a file against them till I got them down to the circumference of the factory cardinal 4 disc.


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handyandy
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« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2017, 06:11:11 AM »

After getting them filed down I then used a small round file normally meant touching up a chainsaw chain to file the center hole out to match the oblong hole the factory drags have. They are oblong to keep the disc from spinning when they are in the reel as the metal disc spin and the fiber drag disc stay stationary. The last is a comparison as to what the carbontex drag disc started as and how the two turned out compared to the factory drag disc that are some kind of hard fiber drag disc not sure as to what kind. My drag was kind of sticky to start with that's what prompted this. I took the whole reel apart cleaned and serviced it and figured I'd give making a set drag disc a shot while I was at it.


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handyandy
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« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2017, 06:16:34 AM »

After getting the holes filed out and pretty darn close to the original disc I did a trial fit over the plastic housing they sit when on the reel. I didn't do a full tutorial on taking the reel apart and putting it back together as Tommy already did a superb tutorial covering it pretty well. The disc fit pretty and wouldn't turn on the plastic housing which is how it's suppose to be since the metal washers in the drag stack have a round center hole allowing them to stay stationary and the carbon disc spin with plastic housing that spins with the pinion.


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handyandy
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« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2017, 06:22:52 AM »

Sorry I just realized some of my wording is incorrect in how the drag stack works. At either rate the fiber drag disc are suppose to fit well on the plastic piece and mine fit nice and snug over it I thought they would work well. They didn't after getting the reel back together they initially worked but if you increased the drag pressure they then spun over the plastic housing. Whatever the original drag disc is are it's a much harder and a bit thicker material than the carbon fiber allowing to not spin over the plastic housing. The carbon fiber was thin and flexible enough despite my holes being filed correctly and fitting snugly over the plastic they rounded out. Thank fully these disc are pretty darn close in size for a dam 220 drag drag disc I will try and make them work in one I have.
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handyandy
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« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2017, 06:36:28 AM »

The plastic drag clicker what I was calling the plastic housing the drag stack goes over splines on the spool shaft and turns with it the drag washers have the oblong hole to fit snug over the clicker and turn with it well. The carbontex washer the oblong hole I filed managed to round out once the drag had bit more pressure on it and wouldn't turn with the clicker. So after cleaning the originals and greasing them I reinstalled them. The reels drag is much smoother than it was since I went through and serviced the whole reel but would have been nice if these washer had work as I think they would have made the drag even better. Oh well still a great reel that will give me many years of service and work just fine was just figured I'd give this a shot to try and make a great reel even better.
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mo65
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« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2017, 10:30:59 AM »

   Great work Andy! I recently fashioned carbon fiber drags to fit some of my reels...a Zebco Rhino conventional, a Daiwa baitcaster, and a DAM Quick 270 Super. They all saw improvement. I fish the Daiwa hard and it is WAY better with carbon fiber than that teflon. One of these days I will pick up a Cardinal...they are awesome! Cool
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Tightlines667
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« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2017, 10:38:03 AM »

I recently purchased a Cardinal 4 (ca. 1978 model) that had been fully serviced/upgraded by a Cardinal enthusiast.  The reel came with CF drags, and a custom titanium bail wire.  The seller offers some of his upgraded parts on Ebay from time-to-time.

John
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Gfish
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« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2017, 11:11:19 AM »

Good post Handy. I also recently got an"old-old stock" Cardinal 4. Only serious replacement needed was the plastic spool with a hard to see hairline crack. Was really thinkin to do the CF upgrade but you saved me the( needed for learning purposes) experience of failure. If ya come up with a good drag disc replacement method/material, please keep us posted!
Gfish
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reelrepair123
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« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2017, 01:05:16 PM »

just  love those  CARDINAL 3,4,6 AND 7 spinning reels.   harryk
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Midway Tommy
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« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2017, 09:04:38 PM »

I've used the ABU/Zebco & ABU Garcia fulcrum brake Cardinals exclusively since 1970 and have never had any issues with the brake discs being sticky or lurching, but I loosen my brake setting between uses during storage and reset them each time I take them out. That seems to help prevent the the stickiness one sometimes experiences after they have been left snug for long periods.

It's interesting that the CF material used wasn't dense enough to prevent wear inside the holes where they are required to remain stationary on the click washer and rotate with it. I wonder if a a thicker piece of material would retain and hold the shape better?     
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Love those open face spinning reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco Cardinals)

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« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2017, 01:45:05 AM »

I totally agree Tommy. If there is space a 1.5mm cf disc should be much stronger. Also the fit of the elliptical hole has to be tight - if its loose wear will result.
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« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2017, 01:54:55 AM »

The original drag washer may have been laminated material with a hard core.
-steve
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handyandy
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« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2017, 06:21:43 AM »

Tommy I now will be loosening the drag after each use. I will make disc for a cardinal 3 when I have time to mess with it. CF should work in it without issue being in the 3 the disc have a round center hole. I test fit the washers before assembly to make sure I had a good snug fit. If some one knows of thicker CF disc that could be modified to fit let me know I'd be willing to give it a shot assuming they don't cost a ton.

 
I recently purchased a Cardinal 4 (ca. 1978 model) that had been fully serviced/upgraded by a Cardinal enthusiast.  The reel came with CF drags, and a custom titanium bail wire.  The seller offers some of his upgraded parts on Ebay from time-to-time.

John

you mind sharing a link for this seller as I would be very interested in his drag disc. Thankfully the disc I made I think are pretty close to size of a dam quick 221 drag disc so I will see if I can make them work in the 221 I need to put back together.
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Tightlines667
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« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2017, 08:51:51 AM »

Tommy I now will be loosening the drag after each use. I will make disc for
 
I recently purchased a Cardinal 4 (ca. 1978 model) that had been fully serviced/upgraded by a Cardinal enthusiast.  The reel came with CF drags, and a custom titanium bail wire.  The seller offers some of his upgraded parts on Ebay from time-to-time.

John

you mind sharing a link for this seller as I would be very interested in his drag disc. Thankfully the disc I made I think are pretty close to size of a dam quick 221 drag disc so I will see if I can make them work in the 221 I need to put back together.

Guy's name is Fred Eyer.

His ebay username is: lmsteelhead

I don't have his phone number or personal email.

John
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