alan tani @ alantani.com fishing reel repair rebuild tutorial Penn 114H drag help
Reel Repair by Alan Tani
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Author Topic: Penn 114H drag help  (Read 598 times)
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Brewcrafter
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« on: October 23, 2018, 09:24:12 PM »


    Just got done reassembling a 114H with a kit from Alan.  This is probably my 6th or 7th reel and all seemed to go well.  All back together with a new drag stack and it seems to work better than ever, BUT: when the drag is tightened, now the wave washer between the handle and the drag hat is loose and rattles freely.  I've never noticed this before, so hoping for some input.  My random thoughts:
    The reel and drag appears to be operating smoothly and normally
    The new drag stack was pretty close in height to the original (I did not bust out the micrometer) but I stacked them side/side and they looked close, and upon assembly the last eared washer was seated in the gear, the final fiber washer was split/slightly above the gear, and the final keyed metal washer was entirely above the gear.
    I am afraid that given that the wave washer is loose, that the star might be prone to self moving in a fight.  So:
    Do I just not worry about it and fish?
    Do I add additional fiber or metal washers (I know they will not increase drag, only act as spacers) to reduce the number of turns between "freespool drag" and "lockdown" to close up the space under the handle?
    Do I look at additional washers such as Bellevilles to place under the handle in place of the thin wave washer to take up/control the space?
    Thanks in advance for the guidance!
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    RowdyW
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    « Reply #1 on: October 23, 2018, 11:01:59 PM »

    The Top Hat looks like it is sitting a little low in the plate. I would add one more keyed washer to the top of the stack. That should also take care of some of the space between the handle & star wheel.       Rudy
    « Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 11:14:02 PM by RowdyW » Logged
    thorhammer
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    « Reply #2 on: October 24, 2018, 07:19:33 AM »

    If i recall correctly the Boss himself tosses those wave washers because the trap corrosion quickly.
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    Dominick
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    « Reply #3 on: October 24, 2018, 09:27:02 AM »

    I kind of agree with Rudy, but I would like to see the drags and washers in a stack and laid out.  If I remember the sequence the keyed washer should just barely fit at the top of the stack.  Can't answer without more.  Dominick
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    Gfish
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    What? Me worry?


    « Reply #4 on: October 24, 2018, 01:58:35 PM »

    Was the picture taken with the star loose, tight, somewhere inbetween?
    « Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 02:00:35 PM by Gfish » Logged

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    Tiddlerbasher
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    « Reply #5 on: October 25, 2018, 03:27:15 AM »

    I toss the thin waveywasher and fit 1 or 2 (dependant upon space) stainless bellevilles. Also delrin washer under the tophat - smooooth
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    Donnyboat
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    « Reply #6 on: October 25, 2018, 09:34:09 PM »

    Yes Rudy is correct, another bevelled washer with raze the top hat, that will give you more tention, & with the top hat higher, you will get less water inside the face plate, the Boss tosses, the wave washer away, but if you wish to use it, then it belongs under the star, also have a delrin washer imediatly under the star, that will make your star easier to turn, hope this helps, if anyone does not agree with me, please comment, I can handle that, we are all learning, cheers Don.
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    Don, or donnyboat
    alantani
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    « Reply #7 on: October 25, 2018, 10:01:18 PM »

    If i recall correctly the Boss himself tosses those wave washers because the trap corrosion quickly.

    yup, i usually just toss those........   Undecided
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    « Reply #8 on: October 25, 2018, 10:16:30 PM »


    All great questions and thank you for the support!  Dominick I have (I hope) included a picture that I took of the old vs. new stack (both stacks minus the undergear - the original undergear was in shreds!).  I don't have them layered in their appropriate order but I was just looking to compare and confirm overall stack height prior to reassembly, and while you can see they are somewhat different my initial thought was that it wasn't enough to be overly concerned about, today I am thinking I may have been wrong and should have been more attentive!
    To Gfish the original photo of the drag with the gap between the handle and the star with the wave washer rattling loose was taken with a "semi snug" drag setting.  I say that only because I did spool about 10' of junk line on the reel just to pull and test the reel for smoothness and it slipped evenly with a solid pull; once it is fully spooled and mounted on a rod I will take out the scale and see where we netted out since everything I have read on the forum I seem to understand that is the only real way to do it to get drag #'s.  But regardless, to hopefully answer Gfish's question I could get about another 180 degree turn on the star in that photo to hit "bottomed out locked up solid".
    As to Rudy's suggestion; I have tried adding a metal keyed washer as an additional "spacer".  Results were as follows:  With the extra washer I had a total movement of the star of one full revolution (360) between being backed off fully against the wave washer/handle (and at this point I could still feel light drag on the spool, but it was minimal) and being tightened to "total lockdown" (again, I only have about 10' of line on there, but it was tight!).  Without the extra metal washer (as shown in the original photo at the beginning of this thread) I actually get about 2.5 full rotations of the star from "backed out against the handle" to "socked down solid on the stack".   But in that configuration (as pictured originally) there is a point in there where the star does not have a lot of pressure against it to hold position, and my fear is that in a battle it might be easily loosened or tightened inadvertently (here is where the lever drag folks will admonish me to purchase an International - yes I want one, I have an Avet and I am liking the advantages of multiple gears and lever drags, but that is not what this is about).
    For some backround: this reel is being rebuilt/setup purely as a SoCal troller - all bearings were greased as opposed to oiled and I was not overly concerned with excess friction or spool run times  - nobody is going to try to cast or even fly line a bait with this thing (but it still goes in/out of gear just fine).  Maybe if I were to add the extra washer and then remove the thin wave washer between the handle and the star?
    Thank you for all of the support! - John
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    RowdyW
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    « Reply #9 on: October 25, 2018, 10:40:29 PM »

    With the extra keyed washer in the stack it sounds like you have the proper setup. With the star backed off it is ok to have minimal to no drag. With the drag partially or fully turned down it is normal to have some space between the star & the handle. If everything is assembled correctly the star will stay at whatever setting you set it. The drag setting will stay where you set it unless you manualy move the star.             Rudy
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    Brewcrafter
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    « Reply #10 on: October 26, 2018, 03:34:31 PM »

    Thank you everyone!  I went ahead and followed the suggestions of adding an extra keyed washer on top of the stack as a spacer, and this time removed the wave washer that is between the handle and the star.  This gives about 1 and 1/2 revolutions of the star from fully out to locked tight, and everything is working just the way I like to see it!  Thanks! - John
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