Did Abu Garcia change the alloy of their gears?

Started by tincanary, January 14, 2019, 07:33:28 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

tincanary

I ask this because I saw somebody mention on another forum that the newer Abu Ambassadeur reels are unreliable because they changed the alloy of the gears.  Is this false information?  I thought I'd ask here as this is the most knowledgeable group of reel repair people I've seen.

0119

Abu doesn't state what the gears are made of on their website.  I think often times when folks announce that the model Ambassadeurs are unreliable, they are determining this in confusion.  They lump together low tier chinese made round reels in the Abu line up, with the C3 and C4 series, the true Ambassadeurs.  That said I don't own, never had tried nor will ever own a current model Ambassadeur.  I have too many Swedish pre Pure Fishing conglomerate reels to ever need a new one.

tincanary

#2
A well known Abu tuner says the brass gears are now made in China and he suspects they may be of lesser quality than the reels produced prior to the year 2000, key word being may.  I don't want to name names as the fellow seems to be well respected in the Abu world.  I found it interesting, it was the first I've ever read of such a claim and I'm no stranger to these reels.  I have a number of post 2000 reels and never have I had a main gear or pinion wear out on me.  Granted, I fish only freshwater, but I have a fair share of chinook salmon, steelhead, large pike, and musky under my belt.  Honestly, to me, it sounds like the guy just has an issue with some components of the Swedish reels being made in China so he has to knock them as being inferior products.  I saw no evidence backing up his claim no matter how much I searched.  Sounds like hot air to me.

exp2000

I understand that for many years now, the label; "Made in Sweden" really means "Assembled in Sweden" as the parts are actually imported from China yet I have noticed no decline in quality commensurate with that change.

But I have noticed a step down in the manufacturing quality of components in the last few years with defective components becoming nothing unusual such as free spinning drive cogs on satin finish worm gears rather than the traditional "mirror" polish.

The overall quality of the most recent model while not terrible, is definitely a distinct step down.
~

Robert Janssen

Quote from: tincanary on January 15, 2019, 12:39:18 AM
....it was the first I've ever read of such a claim and I'm no stranger to these reels.  I have a number of post 2000 reels and never have I had a main gear or pinion wear out on me.  ...  I saw no evidence backing up his claim no matter how much I searched.  Sounds like hot air to me.

Well then why question it?

Quote from: exp2000 on January 15, 2019, 06:00:38 AM
I understand that for many years now, the label; "Made in Sweden" really means "Assembled in Sweden" as the parts are actually imported from China

It does not. The vast majority of round Ambassadeurs up to and including 60xx size, are made and assembled in Svängsta. Gears too. There used to be a film clip online of their gear hobbing machine making gears. In Svängsta.
An exception to this is the lo-budget line of BCX and similar reels, made far away. Reels purportedly made in Sweden are made in Sweden.

The larger reels, 70xx and up, are made in the far east, and have been for a long time. There was a supplier who made the gold colored Big Game series in the mid-2000s, who had a rumor about them as having used inferior gear material. Whether or not this was accurate or not, who can say. This manufacturer no longer supplies Abu.

Quote from: 0119 on January 14, 2019, 11:26:43 PM
Abu doesn't state what the gears are made of on their website. actually they do in the Swedish Tight Lines catalog, but they just call it Duragear I think often times when folks announce that the model Ambassadeurs are unreliable, they are determining this in confusion.  They lump together low tier chinese made round reels in the Abu line up, with the C3 and C4 series, the true Ambassadeurs. 

Absolutely. I can't understand why Abu pollutes their product lineup with a lo-budget line. Rolls Royce doesn't have a lo-budget economy car. Virgin Airways doesn't have a lo-budget Tourist Class. Dom Perignon doesn't sell cheap liquor.

.

exp2000

#5
Quote from: exp2000 on January 15, 2019, 06:00:38 AM
I understand that for many years now, the label; "Made in Sweden" really means "Assembled in Sweden" as the parts are actually imported from China

I recall reading this many years  ago on some forgotten website.  

QuoteIt does not. The vast majority of round Ambassadeurs up to and including 60xx size, are made and assembled in Svängsta. Gears too. There used to be a film clip online of their gear hobbing machine making gears. In Svängsta.
An exception to this is the lo-budget line of BCX and similar reels, made far away. Reels purportedly made in Sweden are made in Sweden.

Thanks for clarifying. What you say makes sense. Apologies if my information is incorrect.


Quote from: 0119 on January 14, 2019, 11:26:43 PM
They lump together low tier Chinese made round reels in the Abu line up, with the C3 and C4 series, the true Ambassadeurs.  

The material quality of the latest generation C4 with the angled drag star does not appear to be as good as the traditional Swedish classics. Do you know what is responsible for this change?
~




Keta

Quote from: Robert Janssen on January 15, 2019, 10:07:19 AMI can't understand why Abu pollutes their product lineup with a lo-budget line.

I think it has something to do with supplying Wallmart with reels they can sell for less than the smaller retail outlets can buy them for wholesale.  I get a few PRC ABU reels in every year and I try to educate the owners.  They work but that's about all
I can say.
Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way.
Mark Twain

festus

#7
Quote from: tincanary on January 15, 2019, 12:39:18 AM
A well known Abu tuner says the brass gears are now made in China and he suspects they may be of lesser quality than the reels produced prior to the year 2000, key word being may.  
Got an Abu I bought new around 1992 and another bought new in 2009. Never been able to tell any difference in the gears.  Other than the plastic yoke and the plastic position holder they are probably as solidly built as the older ones.

I don't want any of the newer BCX or S series.  The metals are inferior and a better deal and better product can be found in the KastKings and Ming Yangs.  The lowly BPS Megacast round baitcaster is 35 to 40 bucks, probably ok as a loaner reel or something to be used maybe 5 or 6 times a season.

tincanary

Thanks for the replies everybody, very informative.  For what it's worth, the subject came up elsewhere in a Calcutta vs Ambassadeur debate.  I own and love both reels but just thought the claim I read was strange as I've never heard it prior.

GulfOfBothnia

Abu is advertizing some reel gears made of "super brass" (supermässing in swedish).  At least in yearly catalog 2018 for some Swedish made ambassadeur reels. I have no idea what it means.

Pro Reel

What reels sold under the brand name Abu Garcia are still actually made in Sweden? I was under the impression that only a very few special production Ambassaduers were still being produced there. I do know that the vast majority of Abu Garcia reels I see are Korean made.

0119

Quote from: 0119 on January 14, 2019, 11:26:43 PM
They lump together low tier Chinese made round reels in the Abu line up, with the C3 and C4 series, the true Ambassadeurs.  

The material quality of the latest generation C4 with the angled drag star does not appear to be as good as the traditional Swedish classics. Do you know what is responsible for this change?[/quote]

I'd say what is responsible is a combination of the consumer and Abu's owner Pure Fishing.  Pure Fishing is a master at consuming companies, cheapening them to the smallest financial denominator and the ever popular engineering mantra that a product should be disposable as next years improved version has to be sold.  The consumer, because they fell for the industry brainwashing that you just gotta get next years new and improved version.  I'm a Ambassadeur snob.  I will only own and use Abu's made by the original company owners.  That leaves me using custom reels made with NOS parts by Jerry Foran.