Tiny guides for a spinning rod

[JasonGotaProblem]

I'm disappointed to say it was casting better before I wrapped it. I have no idea what went wrong.

Still catches fish though.

[oldmanjoe]

       I bet he bent the stick pretty good ...  
 Plus 1 guide change it any ?   Or you over thinking about casting ......

[philaroman]

I'm disappointed to say it was casting better before I wrapped it. I have no idea what went wrong.

see if that's true w/ lure-weight closer to the blank's max & calm weather
I'd guess the tiny running guides are too short:
more distance-robbing occasional grazing contact w/ blank during a cast
(esp., w/ smaller terminal weight, silky braid and windy conditions),
but, also, better sensitivity & control working a lure w/ line fairly taut
everything's a trade-off

[JasonGotaProblem]

Yeah this rod definitely goes past 120° bend. The jack got me bent preet good but not compared to what came next. I hooked a probably 30"+ red but he got me hung up on a piling while I was palming the spool. This blank is plenty tough. The dang dolphins scared everything away. And now it's pouring. Hopefully it'll calm down in a bit.

  Plus 1 guide change it any ?   Or you over thinking about casting ......

Line tracks the bend of the rod way better with that 10th guide. And user error is what I thought initially, and still consider it a possibility. but it might not be the only issue.

I found myself wondering if the issue is line rubbing on the wraps. Potentially since they're not a smooth oval like some of you guys do it. I may need to smooth it out a bit. I just worry more height might be worse. I'm gonna try to do some slomo video and see what I can see.

For what it's worth though, I expected sensitivity but I'm still blown away by how sensitive it actually is.

[oldmanjoe]

     Try the split shot again , you were throwing a honest 40 yards ..

   Check the tag ends ,that may stand proud with epoxy in the path of the line or a forhan locking thread ?

[oc1]

Yeah this rod definitely goes past 120° bend.

That's no the rod's fault  It's up to you to keep the tip angled 90* from the butt so you are transferring the load and fighting the fish lower down in the rod.

[JasonGotaProblem]

I put the same split shot on, topping out around 25-30 yards.

Yeah this rod definitely goes past 120° bend.

That's no the rod's fault  It's up to you to keep the tip angled 90* from the butt so you are transferring the load and fighting the fish lower down in the rod.

I wasn't saying it as a bad thing. The rod can take some abuse is all.

Edit: I'm hitting 40 yds now that I'm not casting like a moron. It happens.

[Rivverrat]

   That rod... well... that Dog Will Hunt. You could put another layer of epoxy. I would not. I'm just glad you posted your work & am even more happy to hear your excited about it... Jeff

[Jeri]

Well done with completing your first rod build, and it seems to work; though there have been some hiccups along the way.

Tag end:  I prefer to use a scalpel rather than a craft knife, the blades are thinner and much sharper. Once the whipping is complete, hold the tag end at 90 degrees to the blank and slide the scalpel blade own the thread - a bear rocking motion will clean cut the tag end at the blank, without fear of any damage to the blank. Then burnish and you have a very clean run of whipping over the guide, and evenly spaced threads.

Thread Tension:  We prefer to mount all our bobbins of thread on small spools (typically 100 yds), and then mount the spool in a fly tier's bobbin holder - this avoid un-necessary skin contact with the thread, and maintains constant tension, without external mechanisms. The skin contact issue, is to avoid skin oils getting on the thread, which like silicone can affect the setting of resin.

You wondered about the performance initially, then found latter that it perhaps wasn't as bad as you thought. This may cause you to wonder every time you use the rod, whether there might have been more potential distance in the build. This comes about because you skipped a step in the build process - dry testing. Most casting rods builders will dry test rods before deciding on the final placement of guides. Some surf casters in the UK even will carry on fishing with guides just taped onto the rods for weeks or months, with high tack tapes. The value of dry testing is paramount, as it gives you the option to fine tune the guide spacings to suit that particular blank. We have some new blanks coming to us in the next week or so, and all will be dry tested before they even see some thread, just to get optimum casting performance organised. This is a common mistake in rod building, the enthusiasm to 'build' - and perhaps not wrong, but misses out on a lot of potential options. It also highlights the possible flaws in building to pure 'recipes' as suggested by some folks - sometimes a small change in the 'recipe' can give huge improvements.

Mistakes and errors are all part of the learning curve, and help us develop the skills, as well as how to correct mistakes in the future.

Glad that you have enjoyed the experience, now unfortunately starts the addiction phase .................

[JasonGotaProblem]

Aaaand I've already moved on to the next project. It really is a rabbit hole. Ive stripped the guides off a 2 piece 5'6" 4-8# ugly stick. I actually kinda like the action but the guides are garbage and one of them is 15°+ out of line from the rest. I have that set of alconites that didn't quite fit on the other rod, they fit just great on here. Yes, I am polishing a turd. But man that turd casts like a champ now. Gonna try to have it ready for service for my mountains trip. Figure it can be strapped to the side of a backpack or something. Stripping the old guides, sanding the blank, and spacing the new guides took about 2 hours. You can still see a bit of the epoxy where the old guides were. But then it is called an ugly stick. Is there an easy way to get rid of the remaining epoxy? I really don't care that much, it's called an ugly stick for a reason. But if it's an easy fix I'd fix it.

And Jeri, I was comparing the performance with the guides taped to performance after wrapping. I did not test between wrapping and epoxy, maybe I should have.

The wind has been too strong to meaningfully test how it handles an unweighted rubber worm (the primary intended use for the rod). With 15mph tail winds one may be tempted to think those long casts are the norm. I want a fair test. Worst case scenario I'll order some size 6 guides and rewrap. No big deal.

[steelfish]

........Yes, I am polishing a turd. But man that turd casts like a champ now.

nothing wrong with that, specially if you like the action of the blank

I changed the guides on two or 3 of my personal factory rods and they feel different, line goes more smooth when casting and specially when retrieving the line, also doesnt hurt to put your color of choice on the guides to make a rod look like a custom rod.

this Tica UMGA 7ft surf rod have a great action and it was missing some guides when I bought it, so I changed the guides for some Titanium and Carbide ring, those guide might worth more than the rod but now the combination of the guides, colors and action of the short surf rod make it a great rod to stay

this is the regular cheap guides the rod had and the ones I installed later .
more about this rod here  https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=28392.0

same deal with my musky rod and Mario Bros themed rod, this one have a composite blank but it also had regular welded wire boat guides (I hate those), So I cut 5" from the tip and 6" from the butt and made me a short "panga rod" with TW spiral foolproof guides, now the rod feel stronger but still with some flex on the tip https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=31101.0

[oldmanjoe]

    You are getting impatient again .....   Take the time to clean off the remaining epoxy with a  razor blade 90 degrees to the blank  .   Just rub it back and forth ,it will come off .   Just remember the guides don`t have to go back in the original place .     Ugly stik , it`s up to you to make it shine now ..

[oc1]

After removing the scar left behind by the old guides there will still be a shadow where the clear coat finish has been scraped away.  On really old rods with brittle varnish finish I have scraped the entire blank as Joe describes. Epoxy will not come off as easily. After scraping you can lightly sand to even everything out.  But, you will then have a matt finish and will feel obligated to clear coat the entire rod again after it is wrapped.

[JasonGotaProblem]

I actually ended up moving the bottom guide up a bit on my first build. I had made some last minute adjustments to position (read: it fell off while wrapping and I had to ballpark it and got it wrong). think I actually did too good a job removing the epoxy because I couldn't find the mark from where it was previously. So I had to trial and error it to find where it should belong. 90° razor scrape followed by some 1000 grit sanding and it was good to go.

A combination of that, and just getting a bit more practice casting such a light rod (I really didn't expect it to be that different!) I'm now throwing free line soft plastics ~45yds , and heavier lures a bit further.

In other news I caught my first bass on it today. Decent lil fella. The jack was more fun though.

[Rivverrat]

... I'm now throwing free line soft plastics ~45yds , and heavier lures a bit further.

In other news I caught my first bass on it today. Decent lil fella. The jack was more fun though.

  An honest 45 yards with lite fake baits is very acceptable. For an ultra lite combo 8' & under, set up to fish & not just cast, any cast approaching 50 yards or more is stellar ... Jeff