okuma cortez cz-10csa , weak drag problem

[circlehook]

I was hoping someone on here might have some good advice for me .

I recently acquired this reel new off "the auction site " . It seems fine and I even  opened it up to degrease the spool bearings (with great results, BTW).

Anyway, I assembled it back exactly as per the schematic and filled the spool . While the drag works, I can seem to get the drag very tight at all . I measured with a luggage scale and it measures at about 6 lb of constant pull with the star drag cranked which is way less than the published specs. (albeit with a full fairly tall spool).  I'm sure I assembled the drag stack  back as per the  schematic . In layman's terms, a mildly firm tug pulls line even with the drag cranked.
I disassembled once again to verify
 This time , I degreased both the carbon  and steel washers with isopropyl alcohol (milder than naptha) , including the washer behind the gear .

Same results as before . I even tried adding a shim washer before the star drag wheel to increase max pressure with no improvement .

 Any thoughts ? In hindsight, I should have tested the drag before opening it the first time . How would I know if the OEM washers are shot ? They still have texture and the reel was shipped with the drag loose. They were mildly greasy (less now since I dipped them in isopropyl alcohol).

[Porthos]

How far do you need to turn the star down before the drag engages?

...I even tried adding a shim washer before the star drag wheel to increase max pressure with no improvement...

"...washer before the star..."

So nut > handle > star > washer > bellevilles > spacer > washer > drag washer...?

[jtwill98]

I don't know anything about the reel and not sure about the washer stack order. 

I was just wondering if the washer with the ears suppose to be facing down? And, is it near the bottom or top of the stack?

If bottom, wouldn't it leave too much space underneath it to come in contact with the fiber washer?

[Porthos]

Have a range of Okuma star drags (SD's, CT's, CLR, MA's) and most, if not all, are the 3-stack design.

[jurelometer]

I have one of those- let me check...

18 lbs with a full spool/greased stack-  before I get nervous about stripping the threads on the aluminum star.This  is same as the Okuma official max drag number.

Your drag washers look fine.

I do remember that the drag stack was a bit finicky to get seated properly. The eared washer can jam a little on assembly before it gets seated, and/or slip out of the pockets on the main of the gear when when flipping the  reel around and attaching the sideplate, before the star secures everything.

The other thing is that i think that the one way bearing has to be able to move for the drag to tighten, so maybe make sure that it is not obstructed by corrosion, etc.

Otherwise, the usual stuff.  Make sure that the eared washer is oriented correctly (the ears pointing toward the bottom?) and that it can move smoothly,  and that the parts are all there in the right order and orientation. As jtwill98 noted, a common problem for these type of stacks is the eared washer preventing the load from being transferred all the way down to the gear due to wrong orientation or parts missing or out of order.

If I did it right, the drag stack order: under gear > gear > fiber > keyed >fiber > eared > fiber > keyed.   The pairs of keyed and fiber washers are also different sizes if I remember correctly.

If you need a schematic, just enter the model number here: 

https://www.okumafishingpartsusa.com/index.php?func_case=products_search_result&area=USA


A fun reel for jigging, nice and light.  It also casts OK.

-J

[circlehook]

@jtwill98, you might be right . I'll try flipping the eared washer. It was in the correct position (4th from bottom)

For what it's worth, this reel is similar to another reel that is described in this forum but with some key differences . https://alantani.com/index.php/topic,9302.0.html

If I get it sorted out , I'll post a tear down tutorial so folks don't end up with a bunch of springs all over their work area  like yours truly

[circlehook]

How far do you need to turn the star down before the drag engages?

...I even tried adding a shim washer before the star drag wheel to increase max pressure with no improvement...

"...washer before the star..."

So nut > handle > star > washer > bellevilles > spacer > washer > drag washer...?

Yes, I did as you described . My frame of reference was from the opposite aide

[circlehook]

Better results with the eared washer oriented ears - facing away from the drive gear . Got about 9 lb max drag  and usable at this point . I wonder if this reel drag spec is with an empty / near empty spool .

Regardless, thanks !!

Interestingly, non of my other conventional reels,  ...Penn Squall 2 , brand new Daiwa saltist 30 can exert 10 lb drag when spooled up  (despite manufacturer specs claiming higher) . Is this normal ?

[jurelometer]

As noted earlier, I get 18 lbs on the same reel with a full spool and greased washers.

Maybe check your scale?

Manufacturers don't tell us if that drag rating is with a full spool or not.  Lever drags seem to often come out under the max number with a full spool - the pinion side bearing binds first.

Star drags usually come out close, because you can always crank the star down a bit more. They just add a shim to the stack if the star bottoms out.

Whether the reel will hold up for a long time fished at full drag is another story.

-J

[Porthos]

How far do you need to turn the star down before the drag engages?

...I even tried adding a shim washer before the star drag wheel to increase max pressure with no improvement...

"...washer before the star..."

So nut > handle > star > washer > bellevilles > spacer > washer > drag washer...?

Yes, I did as you described . My frame of reference was from the opposite aide

If your extra washer has clearance without rubbing the inside of the plate/AR bearing, try this:

nut > handle > star > bellevilles > spacer > washer > washer > drag washer...

This would push the spacer out more, and allow you to tighten and engage the drag earlier. In the position you have it, unless the extra washer is able to slide into the plate hole when you tighten down (and it can't 'cause the bellevilles are in the way), it will essentially stop at the same point the star originally did and go no further.

[circlehook]

Thanks . I'll try this too. Right now, the spacer is more or less flush with the gray plastic bushing

[alantani]

the center of the main gear has a brass insert that is raised.  if the the first carbon fiber washer is not thick enough, the first keyed metal washer might come in contact.  if the insert and metal washer come in contact, you will never get a high enough drag.  it will always slip because of the metal-on-metal contact. 

the more common cause of a low drag range is braid that is slipping on the spool.  can you let us know?  thanks!  alan

[circlehook]

the center of the main gear has a brass insert that is raised.  if the the first carbon fiber washer is not thick enough, the first keyed metal washer might come in contact.  if the insert and metal washer come in contact, you will never get a high enough drag.  it will always slip because of the metal-on-metal contact. 

the more common cause of a low drag range is braid that is slipping on the spool.  can you let us know?  thanks!  alan

I doubt the braid is slipping on the spool because the spool itself moves when I pull the braid

When spooling , I backed with about 8 to 10 yards of 10 lb mono before braid in order to ensure a solid grip on the spool

[circlehook]

I ordered a set of new drag washers and a few shim washers etc and am going to tackle this again shortly . One of the washers is plastic and one metal . Okuma didn't label them so I'm not sure which is which (see pic)
. Help !

[circlehook]

pics