penn 49 for codfishing

andrew_g · March 30, 2012, 06:58:16 PM

This is my first time posting and I'd like to say hello to Alan and everyone else. Alan, this is a great site and I've learned a lot from reading many posts.

My question is about a penn 49 for new england codfishing. Over the winter I found a penn 49 in my dad's attic. I upgraded it by replacing the old chrome spool with a new aluminum one (also had to replace the bridge along with the main and pinion gears), upgraded the drag washers to HT-100's, and also put on a new stainless steel gear sleeve and jigmaster power handle. What I noticed is that up to 10 pounds of drag, the reel is smooth, but when I max out the reel at around 16 pounds, the drag begins to stick and jump between 13 and 16 pounds. Is 16 the max for this reel? I thought that because the drag washers are so big (almost like a 115 senator) that they would hold more than that.

I like to have 15 pounds of consistent drag for codfishing. I do about 12 cod trips a year (mostly party boat but a few charters) and like to have that much drag because most of the time we are winching the fish up from 200-400 feet. Up to now I've been using a 113h, but since obtaining the mariner I'd like to use it for cod jigging. I like the narrow spool. Don't care too much for level winds and the 49 is a lot easier to thumb than a 113h. This is becoming a long post, but my two questions for anyone reading this are: how much drag do you really need to winch up codfish from the 250 plus feet without the drag slipping, and what is the max drag for the 49 without causing any damage to the reel? Thanks.

Andrew

akfish · March 30, 2012, 07:31:22 PM

I would say you are maxing the drag at 10 pounds. The SS gear sleeve and aluminum spool make it a much better reel, but it's still a 30# class reel.

Alto Mare · March 30, 2012, 11:21:10 PM

Hello Andrew, welcome to the site. I'm glad that you like the older penn reels, I do too. The 49 is a nice reel, but like Akfish mentioned, it is still a 30# class reel. I would recommend the 113H with a narrow kit, that reel would be perfect for your needs. If you do some upgrades that we've been doing here, you would even be able to bring a fish similar to the one that you're showing on your avatar, on the boat...nice fish!
Enjoy your stay, Sal

Bryan Young · March 31, 2012, 01:29:51 AM

Aloha Andrew,

With the drags you are talking about, I agree with Sal, a narrow 113H would be the tool you need. They are known as Yellow Tail Specials (YTS) here in California. Narrowing kits were available by Newell and are still available by tiburon.

Bryan

And welcome to the site.

George4741 · March 31, 2012, 02:00:11 AM

Andrew,
About your sticking drags, are they greased with Cals? If not, that might explain the drag problem. However, I'm of the same mindset as the others and think the 49 is a 30# reel. I believe that many people look at the 49 as equivalent to a 6/0 reel because it is the same diameter, then overtighten the drags and push it way beyond it's capabilities. Most of the 49s I've seen have a bent reel foot or spool out of round.

Again, welcome to the site,
George

andrew_g · March 31, 2012, 06:58:23 PM

Thanks for all the information. I do like the older penn reels. I've acquired quite a few of them. Unfortunately, most of them are not really suited to codfishing. I have quite a few 6/0s and 9/0s which are way too big for codfish. I also have a a lot of the 209s and 309s, some beachmasters, squidders and jigmasters which are on the small side. Sure, a jigmaster could handle most cod, but would be a problem for a large cod and other large fish (ie shark or small tuna) which takes the jig. It looks like I'll be getting some aftermarket parts for my 113h. I've never upgraded a reel to that much of an extent to get new spool, frame, etc so this is going to be fun as well as a challenge. I'll let everyone know how the upgrade turns out. For the present moment, I think that I'll take George4741's suggestion and grease the drag of the 49. I have a cod trip at the end of April and I don't know if I can get all the parts I need to rebuild the 113h in time for the trip. By the way, the fish I'm holding in my avatar is an atlantic halibut. You guys on the west coast and in Alaska have a viable halibut fishery, but the halibut were decimated in New England during the 19th century due to a lack of regulations. Catching one is a very rare experience. I caught that one on a cod trip last october in the gulf of maine. First and probably last one I'll ever catch.

alantani · April 01, 2012, 05:08:09 PM

i would grease the drags and make sure you have a carbon fiber drag washer UNDER the main gear. ten pounds is also about as much as i would ask from this reel.

andrew_g · June 19, 2012, 06:14:24 AM

It's been a while since I last posted. I was gleefully upgrading my 113h (I upgraded it with an international handle and stainless steel gear sleeve) when I came across two 349Hs. One of them was new in the box and the other one was used with a cracked beauty ring. (Pictures below) Hopefully I can find a replacement somewhere. I took both apart and cleaned and greased them. On the used one (the one with the orange handle) I installed a set of 113h greased ht-100 washers and it works fine. On the new one I simply put the asbestos drags in brake disc cleaner and reinstalled them and was amazed at how smooth the drag is. I was shocked. I had no idea that the stock brake lining washers could be so smooth. It functions exactly like the greased Ht-100s. My only concern for this reel is that it has an "open" drag as opposed to a closed drag covered by the side plate. There is a big chrome disc covering the drag (like older 113h models). I'm worried that water will penetrate the drag and corrode the metal washers and ruin the brake lining or ht-100s. Is this the case or am I worrying for nothing? I ask because some of the cod boats I fish from receive a lot of saltwater spray over the sides and depending on the condition of the seas the reels could be getting what is equivalent to a 12 hour long saltwater shower. Thanks in advance.

By the way, I also picked up a baymaster 180 at the same time I got the 349Hs. I just love the old penns!

Andrew

Irish Jigger · June 19, 2012, 08:07:06 AM

Great find Andrew,money well spent.

Keta · June 19, 2012, 03:25:36 PM

Nice, the 349 is my favorite Penn reel and the reason I wanted a narrow 113H Tank, my current halibut reel. 349 parts are hard to find though and I'll probably build a 114H Tank soon.

I have most of my 349s set up with "homemade" thin metal drag washers, 113H SS gear sleeves, SS anti reverse dog (still R&D) and 5 modified Carbontex washers, I'm getting well over 15lbs of drag. I found the drag spiked and was not smooth before putting in 2 Bellville washers under the star, the washers made the drag much better. I bought one of my 349s from akfish and he had it set up with a 3 metal washer setup with 2 Carbontex washers between the metal washers, I don't get as much drag but it's smooth.

Bryan Young · June 19, 2012, 04:12:09 PM

If you are interested in a narrow set-up, Tiburon has a narrowing kit for the 114H. May want to consider this.

George4741 · June 19, 2012, 05:24:33 PM

Andrew,
349's are also one of my favorite reels. I just can't say they are my ABSOLUTE favorite because there are so many good old Penns out there.

Anyway, it's good to see you breathing new life into them. Reading about other forum members using their 349's really excites me.

Did you go with a 1+3 or 1+5 drag stack in the one with 113H washers? I've experimented with both configurations in my 349's, but I've finally settled on a 1+5 drag. Also, what lb test line are you using? I hope you will report the results on a comparison of the different drag materials.

Quote from: andrew_g on June 19, 2012, 06:14:24 AM
My only concern for this reel is that it has an "open" drag as opposed to a closed drag covered by the side plate. There is a big chrome disc covering the drag (like older 113h models). I'm worried that water will penetrate the drag and corrode the metal washers and ruin the brake lining or ht-100s. Is this the case or am I worrying for nothing? I ask because some of the cod boats I fish from receive a lot of saltwater spray over the sides and depending on the condition of the seas the reels could be getting what is equivalent to a 12 hour long saltwater shower. Thanks in advance.

I wouldn't worry about the 349 with greased drags in the short term. The grease will protect things until you can rinse it off. I'm not sure about the dry asbestos drags. $:-\$
George

andrew_g · June 19, 2012, 07:45:35 PM

Quote from: George4741 on June 19, 2012, 05:24:33 PM

Did you go with a 1+3 or 1+5 drag stack in the one with 113H washers? I've experimented with both configurations in my 349's, but I've finally settled on a 1+5 drag. Also, what lb test line are you using? I hope you will report the results on a comparison of the different drag materials.

I wouldn't worry about the 349 with greased drags in the short term. The grease will protect things until you can rinse it off. I'm not sure about the dry asbestos drags. $:-\$
George

I upgraded it to the 1+5 drag. I actually found a box of old penn reel parts at my local tackle shop and in the assortment were some eared washers for the 349h. I know the shop owner and he just gave me the washers. I use the keyed washers from the 113h however. The other one still has stock brake lining drags which I cleaned in brake cleaner and I must admit it runs very very smoothly. I am very surprised at how smooth the old drags are. On my spring scale, I'm getting consistent 20 pounds with the 113h washers. The three thick asbestos washers are delivering a steady 17-18 pounds with no jerking.

I spooled the new reel (the one with Ht-100s )with 40 pound mono. I'm planning to eventually remove some of the mono and put about 200 yards of 65 or 80 pound braid with a top shot of 50-100 feet of 50 pound mono.

Keta, I like that idea of doubling the carbontex washers to substitute for the thick washers. I've been experimenting with 9/0 ht-100s and find that the outer diameter is pretty close in size but the inner diameter is too large for the gear sleeve. Does this matter? Also, I have a bunch of ht-100s for a 49 which are similar in size to 349h washers. The only setback is the small inner diameter is too small for the gear sleeve. With basic hand tools, (I'm a graduate student with student loans so power tools aren't in the budget yet, but old reels are

) what would be the best way to grind down the inner diameter of the ht-100s for the 49. Is it feasible to cut them carefully with a drywall knife or do something similar?

redsetta · June 19, 2012, 09:46:32 PM

QuoteI've been experimenting with 9/0 ht-100s and find that the outer diameter is pretty close in size but the inner diameter is too large for the gear sleeve. Does this matter?

G'day and welcome Andrew,
The larger ID won't matter within the main gear, but can move about if used above its edge.

QuoteWith basic hand tools, what would be the best way to grind down the inner diameter of the ht-100s for the 49. Is it feasible to cut them carefully with a drywall knife or do something similar?

Best use a round file for the ID.
I usually clamp together two eared metal washers, sandwiching the CF washer, and file out the excess.
The same technique can be used for OD, though I use a bench grinder (and keyed washers of course).
Hope that's of some assistance.
Good luck, Justin

George4741 · June 20, 2012, 04:05:43 AM

Quote from: andrew_g on June 19, 2012, 07:45:35 PM

I upgraded it to the 1+5 drag. I actually found a box of old penn reel parts at my local tackle shop and in the assortment were some eared washers for the 349h. I know the shop owner and he just gave me the washers. I use the keyed washers from the 113h however. The other one still has stock brake lining drags which I cleaned in brake cleaner and I must admit it runs very very smoothly. I am very surprised at how smooth the old drags are. On my spring scale, I'm getting consistent 20 pounds with the 113h washers. The three thick asbestos washers are delivering a steady 17-18 pounds with no jerking.

Good man, Andrew. If you have the extra eared metal washer, then using the 113H keyed metals and HT100 washers is the easiest and sneakiest way to get a 1+5 drag stack into a 349.

I did that on my first 349. I also installed stainless gear sleeves and 501 spacer bars to stiffen the frames.

Quote from: Keta on June 19, 2012, 03:25:36 PM
I found the drag spiked and was not smooth before putting in 2 Bellville washers under the star, the washers made the drag much better. I bought one of my 349s from akfish and he had it set up with a 3 metal washer setup with 2 Carbontex washers between the metal washers, I don't get as much drag but it's smooth.

Lee, are those true bellville washers or the stock wavy washers? I doubled and tripled up the wavy washers on mine.
George