Penn mag power 970 side plate removal??

[Bigpatty]

Hello to all,
Quick question. I just brought another 970 which is mint,, never been fished by the look of it. Brought from the daughter sadly owner no long around.
The spool is really stiff so naturally I suspect seized bearing OR just solid grease etc.
My problem is the reel being mint,,,, I'm having a hard time getting the clicker side plate off and don't want to start wedging a knife or something in there. Have not attempted the other side plate yet as figured the clicker one is easier.
Any ideas?? I drip some wd40 around the side plate to gold plate joint tonight and leave. Don't want to scratch or mark this baby,,,, ;-) going to be very well looked after!!!!
Cheers.

[Swami805]

Try putting it in the freezer for a couple hours. Take off the handle side if you can and push from behind. Pretty common for those to be super tight
Also those side plates can crack if you tighten the side plate screws too much, be careful
I think there's a couple threads on here somewhere that would be helpful but my search skills are lacking

[Bigpatty]

Try putting it in the freezer for a couple hours. Take off the handle side if you can and push from behind. Pretty common for those to be super tight
Also those side plates can crack if you tighten the side plate screws too much, be careful
I think there's a couple threads on here somewhere that would be helpful but my search skills are lacking

Good info,,, I'll have a search. I did already find an old thread about a strip and rebuild saying the side plates can be tight. But the OP never mentioned how to remove if they were.
I'm also aware side plates are extremely rare and getting more like dinosaur poop!!,,, hence my caution. Cheers.

[JasonGotaProblem]

I'd say dino poop (coprolite) is far easier to find than a 970 tail plate. Also wedging in something made of hard plastic instead of metal will be less likely to scratch. Tiny lift. Move to another spot, repeat. Don't try to pry it off on one pop from one spot.

My advice: Get it off once. Grease the metal under it. Don't overtighten the screws, and then don't remove it again unless you really need to.

Also: put a steel sleeve and a 5 stack drag in it and you've got a MONSTER.

[Bigpatty]

I'd say dino poop (coprolite) is far easier to find than a 970 tail plate. Also wedging in something made of hard plastic instead of metal will be less likely to scratch. Tiny lift. Move to another spot, repeat. Don't try to pry it off on one pop from one spot.

My advice: Get it off once. Grease the metal under it. Don't overtighten the screws, and then don't remove it again unless you really need to.

Also: put a steel sleeve and a 5 stack drag in it and you've got a MONSTER.

I'll have to research the steel sleeve,, washers I know about as have changed in some 113's and jig 500's I inherited. Thanks for tip, I've run wd40 around both side plate joints for now and will leave for day or two before next attempt to remove. I have another boxed unused 970 so will try to source  2 x steel sleeves and sets of drag washers. Not easy to find Penn parts here in France.

[JasonGotaProblem]

Steel sleeves are in my opinion the most important upgrade on a Penn conventional. They are the weak link. I know Cortez conversions will ship overseas. The website isn't set up for it but send him a message and he'll likely help, I know he has done so for others in the past.

[Brewcrafter]

Also maybe a "light" hit with a file/course sandpaper around that rim?  Bill Barella just talked me through saving a beautiful picture plate (yes there will be a write up; let's just say it is a cool unusual reel) that had "bakelite swell".  All good now, but definitely a "take your time and go slow" type of modification.  And needless to say - dust control/sand wet/wear a mask.... - john

[Bigpatty]

Steel sleeves are in my opinion the most important upgrade on a Penn conventional. They are the weak link. I know Cortez conversions will ship overseas. The website isn't set up for it but send him a message and he'll likely help, I know he has done so for others in the past.

Just visited the Cortez website,,, wow!!! Didn't see any stuff for the 970 but will message them. I have 23 conventional Penn, ABU reels. Could get expensive!!! Really I'd just like to upgrade the surf capable stuff. I know people talk about surf fishing jigmasters But I can't get my head around that ;-)

[Bigpatty]

Also maybe a "light" hit with a file/course sandpaper around that rim?  Bill Barella just talked me through saving a beautiful picture plate (yes there will be a write up; let's just say it is a cool unusual reel) that had "bakelite swell".  All good now, but definitely a "take your time and go slow" type of modification.  And needless to say - dust control/sand wet/wear a mask.... - john

Thanks for the tip. I have now undone the screws on both side plates and soaked the joint overnight with small drops on wd40,,, still no dice. Neither side plate is budging one thou!! I bet they have never been off. Looks like its been sat idle and not been fished and who ever put the line on clearly never cast it,,,, ;-)) Line is  also new. I know the guy just passed away,,, shame.
Anyway,,, will add more wd today and leave. There is no room at all for any kind or pry tool and to be honest I don't really want to go down that route as the plates and gold alloy are perfect at moment.

[Bigpatty]

It has been my experience that Caveman approaches  like Prying ,Banging, Knocking Around NEVER work well on something like this .
If it was on my bench and truly in the NEW Condition as indicated I would simpye remove the
End Bearings and spray a good Penetrate in there and on the Bearings themselves .Also use a Penetrate with a insertable plastic straw to fit in the oil orifices around the plates.
..There would be No Reason to  really tear it down any further unless you want to do mods .
Being never torn down through the years the plastic has swollen and I doubt you get them off without damage. Good Luck Mon Ami from Monsieur, je sais tout ! lol

I think you are on the money mon ami. They are solid. I removed the left bearing cup and everything in there is solid. Clearly why the spool was not right. I will try to free the bearing cup and remove the right one also and same. I'd really like to get the plates off and get the old lube out and renew. But your advice is valid and on my radar. Bonne journée, crdt.

[JasonGotaProblem]

I have to politely disagree with Leonardo. These reels were made in the 80s. The grease in them is caked. It's due for a re-greasing if you intend to use in salt water.

But that's not my decision to make. It's up to you what you wanna do.

I am of the belief that prying off the sideplate offers the potential of scratching the frame. But I'd be very careful about trying to press it out from the other side. You run the possibility of bending the frame. A scratched frame is castable. A bent frame, less so.

[JasonGotaProblem]

My friend it sounds like I failed to be polite in my disagreement, but I really did try.

I've never pretended to be an expert. I never asked for the sensei title and I still doubt I deserve it. Many if not most of those posts are asking questions not giving answers. I offer opinions not solutions.
With that said, I'll expand upon my opinion further: if you stick something narrow in there and give it a tiny wiggle, then rotate to a different spot and repeat, by the third or fourth time, it'll be free. i used a knife to start. But I live on the edge.    I swapped to something plastic pretty quickly. Vibration, within limits, is also your friend here.

Also see this thread if you wanna read the commentary of a REAL sensei: https://alantani.com/index.php/topic,10273.msg97129.html#msg97129

[Bigpatty]

All good info guys.
The reel has had wd40 dripped around that edge (shown in the photo in previous post by Jason....).
Still not moving although I have not tried in ernest yet as my parents are here in France from UK for their annual holiday. Playing with my tackle while my Mother is around get gets skyward looks!!! ;-)
As mentioned I also have another of these boxed never used and suspect the same situation, so very keen to find a solution.
I have also found I can't get the bearing (or the cover even) out of the clicker side bearing cup. It could be the reason the spool was stiff. So wondering also if there are after market bearings as that one might be toast.
Will update soon (as hate posts that never post the solution) and thanks again for all and any info.
Bonne Journee

[jurelometer]

 I think that some of the advice here is based on reels with  Bakelite sideplates, but this is a different problem.

Some of the later generations of the Penn classic reels did not use Bakelite for the sideplates.  The Mag Power reels used this newer plastic. If I remember correctly, the switch was to polycarbonate. 

[Side note :  It is unlikely that the very newest iterations of classics still in production (like the Jigmaster) are  still using Bakelite (outdated), or polycarbonate (too expensive and brittle).   Penn is most likely  are using a fiber filled nylon nowadays.]

Polycarbonate is much stronger and stiffer for the same mass than Bakelite, but is also more brittle. The Mag Power series are prone to cracking from the sideplate screws being tightened.  That is why replacements are hard to find.

The screws just need to be tight enough that they don't come loose over time.  Once the screws are snug, they are mostly required to resist sheer forces, so tighter sideplate screws do not make the real stronger.

Thermoplastics do not generally "swell" over time.  Swelling can occur if a liquid that can be absorbed by the plastic is introduced, but the part will return to the original dimensions if/when the liquid is no longer present. Depending on the plastic, this can be water, the solvents and oils in WD 40, etc. if you suspect that there is a substance in the joint that is holding the parts together, it is best to use a product that will work as a solvent, will not damage the plastic, and will readily evaporate.  Warm water is the best solvent for salt. Isopropyl alcohol works well on most dried up lubricants. Both evaporate readily.

While  thermoplastics don't generally swell over time, they will creep.  Creep is the deformation that occurs when the part is placed under load over time. The longer the time, the higher the temperature , and the greater the load, the more amount of creep will occur.


IMHO: for this situation, the best suggestion from this thread was the one to leave the sideplate in place unless it is absolutely necessary to remove it. I might use a bit of Isopropyl alcohol to clean out the WD-40.

If you do need to take the sideplate out, the key is to not concentrate the load on any one spot, and to use a slower progressive load vs. sudden impact (no hammers ) Freezing can help reduce the part size, but it will temporarily make the plastic more brittle  It could be worth a try to see if it pops out gently, but I would not use a combination of freezing and stronger load. Polycarbonate is not very brittle at colder temperatures, so maybe I am being overcautious.

If you do get the side plate out intact, you will probably need to sand the edges to compensate for the creep before reinstalling.

Hope this helps,

-J

[Bill B]

Just my observations. 

1. WD-40 is not a good penetrant.  It might loosen old grease but there are better on the market.  PB Blaster comes to mind.  Just check in a hidden area to ensure no damage to the plate.  Alcohol is also a good solvent.

2. Try applying gentle heat to the ring to expand the metal.  Inversely try freezing the plate.

3.  As Jason stated, gentle prying around the ring, just a nudge, after using the above methods.

4. In the end, sometimes doing nothing is the best solution.

5. As a side note, the Boss posted a video of him removing a stuck reel foot screw, badly corroded in the anodized aluminum frame.  He applied a generous (A LOT) of heat with a propane torch.  My fear was the melting of the anodized finsh.  In the end the screw came out and the frame wasn't damaged.

Bill