TLD 25 not freespooling

[lyt]

Hey guys,

ok, need assistance....some of you know from the other threads whats going on with my reels.

so I'll make this short.....

i rebuilt one of my TLD25's and now it wont "pop" into freespool.   I used all the parts supplied by alan, followed the guide to a "t".

so i have the reel all together and it appears to work correctly, but only when the drag is loose.   when i tighten down on the drag i cant get any freespool.   this leads me to believe that it is not clicking/popping into freespool.   are the bellevilles and washers in the upgrade kit too tight or something?  

The only way i know this is that on the other reels that i have not yet touched it "pops" into freespool and the one i just reassembled does not.

i cant figure it out....

[Nessie Hunter]

OK, let me try and word this so it makes sense...
Im not the best Technical writer!! :-(

The Spool sort of floats, It is pulled to the right by Spool Drag Tension knob, to adjust drag.
Then the Lever Pulls its further into the Drag Plate on a measured Cam, increasing Drag Pressure as it goes..

On low Drag settings the Drag Washer 'does/should not' touch the Drag Plate At STRIKE.   You have Freespool.
Higher setting pull the Drag Washer up against the Drag plate at STRIKE (Or even at Freespool setting).  NO Freespool...

At all these settings the Lever still adds more drag as it Cams the Spool & Washer harder toward/against the Plate.

So if you back off the Drag Tension Knob almost to falling off and still do not get Freespool, couple of common reasons why;
Grease on Drag washer is to thick. all gummed up against Drag Plate.
Spool shaft Stack = Bellvilles, bearings and other washers etc are not in right order or are to thick.
Something in the Shaft order (Washers, bearings etc) is not right.....

Example; (numbers are just used for example)
So at 10# drag setting at STRIKE (half way to full drag)..   You may still have freespool.
At 15# setting at STRIKE   you will probably lose that Freespool.
As you add drag you are puling the Drag Washer Closer to Drag Plate, eventually it touches and you lose freespool, but get higher MAX drag when Camed all the way to Max...

OK???   First check your Drag Control Knob and makes sure it is backed off enough and set properly,   Freespool....
If that doesnt work and you are not getting freespool when that knob os backed off all the way.
You probably have something wrong or to thick in the Washers or Spool system....

Wow, Now Im confused..   LOL
I hope that helps!!   If not maybe one of the better writers can explain it better....
     




.

[lyt]

Hi Nessie,

excellent writing....i totally understand and am pretty good at mechanical things.   albeit not reels "yet"

I am getting freespool when backed off no problem.

my main issue is that my other TLD "pops"    when i engage the drag "out" of the freespool setting.    the one i just did does not pop.  

NOW, if it's not supposed to pop now.....then perhaps i did it correctly.

I am going to tear it down one more time (should be much faster than the 3 weeks to get to this point )

the other question i have is this:

--  is there any part that absolutely cannot have grease on it.   i didn't go crazy with the grease, but the bellevilles have a little and the outsides of the bearing have a tad too.  

[akfish]

Check to see if the spool arbor cross post is sticking in the left side. This happens occasionally because the plastic frame warps. If it cannot move easily in and out of the left side plate, you'll need to open the hole a bit with a screw drive or drill.

[lyt]

Check to see if the spool arbor cross post is sticking in the left side. This happens occasionally because the plastic frame warps. If it cannot move easily in and out of the left side plate, you'll need to open the hole a bit with a screw drive or drill.

you know....that was my next guess

will too much grease be a culprit?

[lyt]

ok

i just double checked and reassembled.

the reel "appears" to be working correctly, minus the pop.


if you guys can assure me that my tld25 with this upgrade should no longer pop, i will move on to the next one.

the spool arbor was tight....  not the cross pin,  but the shaft itself, and it wasn't moving freely,  I GENTLY  reamed it out a little, but still no pop in when disengaging freespool.


I also happen to think it is #11 lever shaft body....   when i go to insert this part into the lever, the square doesn't really line up with the square on the spool shaft.

could this be it?

my thoughts are that it should still "pop"   or lets call it "engage".  

[lyt]

ok after 1 hour of fiddling, I am convinced that the lack of pop has something to do with the belleville thickness not allowing the pop.

does this sound like a possibility Nessie?

the problem is that i have double checked everything 3 times now and it is all correct.    

[gwills]

Did you measure the thickness of the washer stack?  When doing 1 of mine I got like 4.80mm until I rearranged and got them to 4.61mm.  Always the (())) sequence, just moved the one Alan provided into a different position and they measured correctly.  All of mine pop into freespool with the full upgrade.

[lyt]

Did you measure the thickness of the washer stack?  When doing 1 of mine I got like 4.80mm until I rearranged and got them to 4.61mm.  Always the (())) sequence, just moved the one Alan provided into a different position and they measured correctly.  All of mine pop into freespool with the full upgrade.

hey thanks for that...   ok i tried (()))   then i tried ((())   

yes i have an old school dial caliper only in inches.   not digital.   so im not sure i can get this measurement unless i buy one.

could it really be less than 100ths of a inch will not make it freespool?

[redsetta]

G'day lyt,
Just another option to check: Pull the preload dial off and remove the cam.
Have a good look at it from both sides and make sure the square hole is perfect.
I've had two recently that had damaged cams (due to slightly off-spec main shafts), which resulted in similar symptoms to those you're describing...
Good luck, Justin

[kamuwela]

originally were there 4 all facing one way?  if so try that configuration and then see what happens.  i have seen cases where salt was the loss of free spool so yes a few thousandths makes a big differnce. how ever you configure the stack you always want to be as close as possible but yet not over on the measurment. on your reply you show the stack as ((())
then (())) that should measure out the same. if they came out all facing the same way then the drag is at max already. ex ()() = soft ((() medium or (((( max or fastest ramp up. hope this helps not the best at typing better at talking lol

[lyt]

G'day lyt,
Just another option to check: Pull the preload dial off and remove the cam.
Have a good look at it from both sides and make sure the square hole is perfect.
I've had two recently that had damaged cams (due to slightly off-spec main shafts), which resulted in similar symptoms to those you're describing...
Good luck, Justin

hey justin, appreciate the continued help......

yes this was actually my first concern before I thought it was bellevilles

(BTW i just ordered a digital caliper should be here in a couple days.  ) 


OK so when i assemble the reel all the way up to the point where i install the lever everything looks and feels great---a TON of freespool like well over a minute i would assume.

So I put the lever on in the freespool position and then when i insert the lever shaft body i feel like it does not align onto the square shaft cam.   In the freespool position, its on a 45 angle   basically meaning in my mind i think the square cam should fit onto the square of the shaft behind the threads.   but it does not.   so i figure to myself perhaps that is normal when installing the lever shaft body, and it will seat itself later.   

this is really silly....   i even took apart another of my TLD25's    just to be sure i had everything exactly right.   and i do.   

[lyt]

originally were there 4 all facing one way?  if so try that configuration and then see what happens.  i have seen cases where salt was the loss of free spool so yes a few thousandths makes a big differnce. how ever you configure the stack you always want to be as close as possible but yet not over on the measurment. on your reply you show the stack as ((())
then (())) that should measure out the same. if they came out all facing the same way then the drag is at max already. ex ()() = soft ((() medium or (((( max or fastest ramp up. hope this helps not the best at typing better at talking lol

you know....you would think that.........i am not sure how exactly the bellevilles were when i took it apart, but i figured since i am changing it anyway....it shouldn't matter....  oops

so basically i am waiting on the caliper, then i will know for sure.   I am still amazed that a few .001   will not allow it to pop!   amazing

[lyt]

my thoughts are that this should be square with the grooves....right?

you see how it is angled?   the lever shaft body does not sit down into the grooves well because the cam of the body square does not sit onto the square of the shaft.

[kamuwela]

could it be the stack is too thick and preventing the shaft to fully protrud? have you checked the bellevilles on your other reel? another way is swap spools and see what happens. if its all good then check whats differnt between the two spool set up, ie shims, belleville thickness and configuration.