spool bushings vs. spool bearings

[beachbob]

clearly to me, this forum is mostly comprised of boatmen and not surfcasters.  here in the nor'east, i dunno of any revolving spool reel surfcaster that would choose bushings over bearings - i'm sure there are some, but they're the absolute rare exception.  in the long run, it's all good, do as y'all like.      

[Keta]

Reels do not have tight tolerance and bushing can be made to reduce contact, bushings are not "new and improved" and many fall for advertising hype.

There is a time and place for both but for the AVERAGE fisherman roller bearings are not necessary.

In the late summer/early fall we cast to jumping albacore and they can be very boat shy so long casts are needed at times. I'd rather see clients using a reel capable of making these casts without having to tear the reels down weekly for a cleaning and lube.  The reels on thr charter boat get fished harder than the average sportfishermans gear and see abuse from clients that do not know how to fish the gear as well as I'd like. The older reels keep working, so far I haven't had to replace a cracked/damaged pinion bearing on a 113H.

My personal reels run from old Surfmasters to Penn 70s with many types of reel in between, I kokanee fish (troll and jig) with Calcutta 51's (bearings) and salmon fish with Surfmaster 100 (bushings), ABU 5601 (bearings) and Calcutta 401 (bearings), I'm more interested in accurate casts when steelhead fishing but there are times we need to make long casts for salmon, bushings or bearings don't seem to matter.  One of my best casting reels is a Penn 100.

The bottom line is, most fishermen do not maintain their reels as often as needed and bushings are a better choice for them.  Those of us that do (or have done for us) the needed PM can take advantage of the small differance in friction roller/ball bearings theoretically have over plain bearings for distance casting and flylining smaller live baits.

[Cone]

Bushings tend to wear in and perform better over time. The same can't be said for bearings. JMO Bob

[Killerbug]

Good analogy comparing a reel to a Tour de France bike. These days they cost about the same!  But the likes of Sean Kelly had a sag wagon full of mechanics and hoards of spare components trailing not far behind.  I seek fishing to avoid mankind and any assistance I might need from him. As a one time cyclist and bike mechanic I can only pray that Shimano doesnt do to fishing what they did to cycling.  It is no longer a sport or passion of the middle class, a truly decent bike costs at least $5000.  Fishing has already taken a turn away from common sense thanks to profit obsessed manufacturers and stupid uneducated consumers looking only at shiny chrome and color coordinated rods/reels that as Shimano now totes...'can match your boats hull!'  We allow brand makers and 'internet experts' to convince us we need more tech, more maintenance, more complicated reels capable of acting at Star Trek Warp speed, all to catch a animal with a pee sized brain!  Its all a marketing trap and fishing is now really the manufacturer fishing for your money at a more constant rate with planned obsolesence and continuing style change.

So true.

[slgriffiths]

The bottom line is, most fishermen do not maintain their reels as often as needed and bushings are a better choice for them.  Those of us that do (or have done for us) the needed PM can take advantage of the small differance in friction roller/ball bearings theoretically have over plain bearings for distance casting and flylining smaller live baits.


Agreed.  In spades.
Little bit of salt, little bit of sand - and the roller bearings are toast.
But the bushing just gets a little looser, and a little faster.

[Seachaser]

I think surf casters know more about their reels than the average joe.  The average fisherman does not even know what or where a bearing is located. 

[CapeFish]

The bottom line is, most fishermen do not maintain their reels as often as needed and bushings are a better choice for them.  Those of us that do (or have done for us) the needed PM can take advantage of the small differance in friction roller/ball bearings theoretically have over plain bearings for distance casting and flylining smaller live baits.


Agreed.  In spades.
Little bit of salt, little bit of sand - and the roller bearings are toast.
But the bushing just gets a little looser, and a little faster.

Or the bush corrodes into the frame/sideplate or eats away the spool spindle, bearings unlikely to do that. They rust if you don't look after them and then you throw them away and put new ones in and the damage to the reel is minimal. All my surf reels have bearings in and they have been lasting for years even with frequent wading. Why would manufacturers waste their money putting bearings in? There is surely not some bearing conspiracy action out there, they work very well and are easy to maintain and cheap to replace if they do pack up. If you want to make a 140m cast bearings work well.

[Keta]

I work on a lot of abused reels and have rarely seen this.  SS is far higher on the noblility scale than bronze and reacts to aluminum much faster. 
Do a little test, drill and tap a piece of aluminum and put SS, brass and steel screws in the holes.  Place the piece in salt water for a week and see what material comes out easiest.

Bearings have their place but they have become a marketing tool.

[Alto Mare]

I think surf casters know more about their reels than the average joe.  The average fisherman does not even know what or where a bearing is located. 

I'm not so sure about your statement . Lets take this wonderful site for instance. There are lots of average joe here, about 5,000 worth daily, made up of 50% active members and the rest visitors. I also consider myself an average joe and I happen to know where my bearings are.
I would agree with you that there might be a few that don't have a clue, but thanks to Alan and his great site, they're quickly diminishing.

[Killerbug]

I think surf casters know more about their reels than the average joe.  The average fisherman does not even know what or where a bearing is located.  

Surf casters knows what they need to know, about casting bullet shaped weights as far as possible. There is a lot more to fishing(casting) than that.  The favorite reel design, of many, if not all surf casters, was developed by a Swedish pike angler(and it had brass bushings  ).

[Killerbug]

I work on a lot of abused reels and have rarely seen this.  SS is far higher on the noblility scale than bronze and reacts to aluminum much faster. 
Do a little test, drill and tap a piece of aluminum and put SS, brass and steel screws in the holes.  Place the piece in salt water for a week and see what material comes out easiest.

Bearings have their place but they have become a marketing tool.

Absolutely!

[Makule]

I only do casting with intermediate to large conventional reels.  No boat fishing whatsoever.  My preference is for BB, not bushings, although I have owned, and still do own, and use reels with bushings.  I find them easier to cast, farther.  This is only my own preference and whatever someone else uses is totally up to them.  I don't care.

I also consider myself an average joe and I happen to know where my bearings are

I'm also average, but sometimes lose my bearings (or is that marbles).

[Alto Mare]

I only do casting with intermediate to large conventional reels.  No boat fishing whatsoever.  My preference is for BB, not bushings, although I have owned, and still do own, and use reels with bushings.  I find them easier to cast, farther.  This is only my own preference and whatever someone else uses is totally up to them.  I don't care.

I also consider myself an average joe and I happen to know where my bearings are

I'm also average, but sometimes lose my bearings (or is that marbles).

funny Albert. I actually should have said : I know where my bushings are. Most of my conventionals that I fish with have bushings....no bearings. 

[slgriffiths]

The bottom line is, most fishermen do not maintain their reels as often as needed and bushings are a better choice for them.  Those of us that do (or have done for us) the needed PM can take advantage of the small differance in friction roller/ball bearings theoretically have over plain bearings for distance casting and flylining smaller live baits.


Agreed.  In spades.
Little bit of salt, little bit of sand - and the roller bearings are toast.
But the bushing just gets a little looser, and a little faster.

Or the bush corrodes into the frame/sideplate or eats away the spool spindle, bearings unlikely to do that. They rust if you don't look after them and then you throw them away and put new ones in and the damage to the reel is minimal. All my surf reels have bearings in and they have been lasting for years even with frequent wading. Why would manufacturers waste their money putting bearings in? There is surely not some bearing conspiracy action out there, they work very well and are easy to maintain and cheap to replace if they do pack up. If you want to make a 140m cast bearings work well.

Yup - good point.  
Dissimilar metal  corrosion or galvanic corrosion will sure make toast out of a bushing.   Over time.
Roller bearings however have a habit of ingesting salt water into the grease (if it's there) and keeping it under the seals, and just plain locking up. And they certainly are not immune to galvanic corrosion - bushings are usually more noble, and have a greater surface area to "sacrifice" before performance becomes a serious issue.  And they don't have cheap cages surrounding their active components either.
The stainless steels used in many bearings have anaerobic corrosion issues as well - stainless isn't all that stainless,  especially in the absence of oxygen.
And I think it's fair to say a plain bearing or bushing can certainly be made to as good a tolerance as a roller bearing.  In fact, I'd say it's easier than with a roller bearing.  Plain or bushing doesn't mean less accurate.
And manufacturers have to catch fishermen - not fish.  Bling is bait... Bushings are simply not  cool - but having an unecessary number of ball bearings in a reel  is cool - to the uninitiated, who don't have to rip them apart and fix them a year or two down the track when they lock up.
New, or looked after well (and many do this, I freely admit - especially those who have specialty needs, like full immersion surf casting and "yak" fishing)  roller bearings certainly can do better.  However most fisherman, dare I say, simply don't provide the necessary care to their reels, as many have said in this thread before me.  
Therefore, in my opinion,  the corrosion and tolerance resistance of bushIngs, and the quite good performance, especially over time,  that they offer are seriously desirable.

Less technology can often be more...

Guess I'd better get off the soap box, and let someone else have a say!

Simon.

[springwell]

I like bushings. 

They are boring. 

I don't need to buy expensive ceramic bearings.

I fish off the beach with my old Penns with bushings.

I clean my reels regularly.

And, I catch fish with them.