Reel Repair by Alan Tani

When it comes to bearings, reels are generally not considered a critical application.  Chinese manufacturers can produce bearings of appropriate quality for this application, at a price point lower than any other manufacturer. The main problem with the Chinese manufacturers is poor quality control resulting in inconsistent quality.  I've noticed this discrepancy in quality control first hand; a pair of brand new bearings from the same manufacturer in the same series, and one almost always spun better than the other.  There is little to no consistence in performance.  Quality bearings will spin similarly assuming both are clean and correctly lubricated.

The largest high quality manufacturer is NMB Bearing, a division of MinebeaMitsumi. NMB is the world's largest producer of high precision miniature and instrument bearings, supplying over half of the precision bearings used the world over.  Their production facilities are located in Singapore and Thailand.  They produce bearings for everything from industrial applications to sensitive instruments to dental tools.  They are the real deal, and the prices are much cheaper than just about every overly hyped bearings one can think of.

There are other well known manufacturers in Japan; namely NSK, KOYO, and Nachi who manufacture most or portions of the range of bearings used in most mid to high end JDM, USDM, and EUDM fishing reels. They are slightly higher in cost than NMB due to lesser volume, but still excellent bearings nonetheless.  This is why I advocate that people retain the factory bearings if they're self servicing, the stuff you have already is most likely superior to whatever you're getting from AliExpress, Boca, or Roro, assuming it isn't worn out.

In the USA, there are three makers; NHBB, Barden, and Timken.  Being domestic suppliers, the largest portion of their products are used by the aviation, aerospace, automotive, and medical industries.  None of those companies can compete price wise with the quality Japanese manufacturers referenced above, much less the Chinese.  I've priced them for my own uses, and they were a bit too much for me to dip my toe in the pool. 

In Europe, GRW is the big player in the high precision instrument bearing market, but like the USA makers, most of their production is for more more critical applications.  They are also prohibitively expensive, with GRWs running upwards of $30 USD each if you were to acquire them to use as spool bearings.  Abu even uses or did use GRWs in their Ambassadeur Pro Rocket models, and even used them in the 80s and 90s in the 1500C and 2500C variants sold in Europe and Japan.

As far as fishing reel bearings are concerned, the quality choice is NMB, who manufacture consistent quality at reasonable pricing thanks to their volume of production.  I run them in all of my reels.  They're cheap, durable, and perform very, very well.  Even as a reel service owner, I include them with my services as part of my routine.  It's simply cheaper for me to swap in new high quality spool bearings than it is for me to go through the trouble of cleaning, testing, maybe cleaning again, and lubricating.  They're removed from the package, given a quick clean to remove storage grease, lubricated, and installed.  Bing bam boom, done.

Most of the bearings used in fishing reels are of such low mass that if addressed in manufacturing can achieve 50,000 RPM or more.  To achieve these speeds the makers place emphasis on retainer materials, machining, ball grade, raceway finish, and lubrication. None of these specifications are controlled by ABEC tolerance standards, they are left entirely to the decision of the manufacturer. This is why ABEC grade has very little to do with bearing performance, but it does make for an easy to sell.

ABEC grades were designated to create a consistent basis for engineers to spec the fitment of a bearing to a shaft or housing. Too loose a fit creates a situation where the bearing isn't correctly seated in place and too tight a fit can compress the bearing rings, removing the internal clearance of the balls, adding friction or even binding. This system was devised in the 30's when machining to hundredths was considered precision. With CNC machining, many quality manufacturers of bearings can hold ABEC 5 tolerances without really any effort.

I hope this cleared up some confusion for everybody reading.  I researched this stuff through and through and had a good discussion with a friend of mine who engineers tooling for various auto manufacturers here in the Detroit area.  Between my testing as well as customer feedback, quality wins over whatever said manufacturer puts on the label.    As it stands, most manufacturers of flavor-of-the-month bearings do exactly that, market to the uninitiated because higher numbers get product out the door.  I hope I've helped you all and if you want to know how to get NMB bearings cheap, I will post my method later on.  I do order from Japan, and the bearings end up running $1 to $2 each when bought in packs of 10 or more.  Stay tuned!

Thanks for that. Is there a way to tell who manufactured a bearing?

Quote from: Swami805 on August 30, 2024, 02:45:14 PMThanks for that. Is there a way to tell who manufactured a bearing?

Yes, NMB has their logo stamped on the bearing shields with most of their models.  As a bonus, the shields are very easy to remove with a fine tipped awl.  The way I get them, I use a proxy service named Buyee.  With Buyee you can shop all over Japan, even with retailers who otherwise wouldn't ship outside of Japan.  I use Buyee to go through Yahoo Shopping, and for my search query, I will use NMB along with the model number.  You can research bearings through the NMB catalog found here: https://mkt.minebeamitsumi.com/bearing_catalog_en  You will be able to decipher model numbers, plus the catalog is so in depth it will tell lubrication requirements, axial and radial loads, etc.

The nice thing with Buyee is they will hold your stuff in storage for up to 30 days, and they do package consolidation to save on shipping.  I just received bearings last week; 10x DDL-1150ZZ Y04, 10x DDR-1040ZZ, 10x DDR-1030ZZ, 20x DDL-740ZZ, and 10x DDR-830ZZ.  These all ran me $112.24 after shipping.  This breaks down to $1.87 per bearing.

That was actually a lot of words about bearings. All useful info. Thank you for taking the time to write it. I've had bearings with NMB stamped on that seemingly performed better than some eBay ceramics. Makes more sense now.

Thanks for posting this tincanary.  Some really good stuff!

While I agree with your conclusions on ABEC rating importance as it relates to reels, I have to nitpick a little in the name of technical accuracy. There is a more to ABEC ratings than external fit tolerances. Those are just the ones that affect assembly. There are a bunch more.

Quote from: tincanary on August 30, 2024, 01:35:29 PMMost of the bearings used in fishing reels are of such low mass that if addressed in manufacturing can achieve 50,000 RPM or more.  To achieve these speeds the makers place emphasis on retainer materials, machining, ball grade, raceway finish, and lubrication. None of these specifications are controlled by ABEC tolerance standards, they are left entirely to the decision of the manufacturer. This is why ABEC grade has very little to do with bearing performance, but it does make for an easy to sell.

ABEC grades were designated to create a consistent basis for engineers to spec the fitment of a bearing to a shaft or housing. Too loose a fit creates a situation where the bearing isn't correctly seated in place and too tight a fit can compress the bearing rings, removing the internal clearance of the balls, adding friction or even binding. This system was devised in the 30's when machining to hundredths was considered precision. With CNC machining, many quality manufacturers of bearings can hold ABEC 5 tolerances without really any effort.

Here is a good overview of ABEC tolernces/ratings:
https://www.engineersedge.com/bearing/ball_bearings_tolerances.htm


This covers pretty much all of the dimensional aspects of the bearing including track and ball dimensions and roundness. Looking at the tables, the differences between ABEC 3 and above are so tiny that it won't matter in a reel.  But for precision equipment that runs continuously at high speeds (e.g. a dental drill hand piece), ABEC ratings in bearings of the same quality will affect vibration and the longevity of bearings. There are also cases where super high precision machinery (not reels) require higher ABEC ratings to help maintain tolerances.


Getting back to my agreement with tincanary- for those of you that think that a higher ABEC rating has got to help a reel cast a little bit better:

I got to play with an actual press used for replacing these type of high ABEC (usually 5)/ high quality bearings in dental drill hand sets.  It is a strong, accurate, super precise piece of equipment, because in order to take advantage of high accuracy bearings, the bearings have to be pressed into position very precisely into very high tolerance pockets in the handset.  This is a far cry from using your thumb or a small hammer to press in a bearing on a reel spool or sideplate. And the accuracy of assembled alignment of the relevant parts of a reel - more like in hundredths of an inch and not ten thousandths! And once you put line on any spool, how balanced do you think it is? Precision is a function of both the bearing and the assembly it is operating in. There will be less resistance if the balls are rolling  down the center of the tracks and not up and down the sides.

The other question is probably going to be ceramics.

Ceramic bearings, full or hybrid are used for increasing the replacement cycle on continuous use high speed applications. The ceramic balls are lighter, harder, and smoother, so they wear more slowly.  I cannot see an any benefit for putting them on a reel other than maybe using full ceramics to minimize the risk of saltwater corrosion. Ceramics can be run dry, so if you can stand the noise, you don't have to muck with using a very light lubricant that needs to be more frequently  replenished as per stainless bearings.  I am skeptical that ceramics will ever be noticeable for actual fishing performance when compared to properly lubed stainless bearings.

If you really want to maximize bearing performance for casting- first think about clean bearings and light lubricants.  Pushing lubricant around takes energy, and this resistance robs performance.  Your stainless spool bearings will actually get the best performance  at first with no lubricant, but they will corrode more easily and wear out faster.  Also start thinking about bearing to shaft alignment, and if there are things that you can do on assembly to improve it.

-J

Thank You for the great information regarding Buyee & NMB, TC —-

Just in time before I place my next bearing order next week.

Appreciate the detail.

Best, Fred

trbrc.com

Thanks, Alan!

Best, Fred

I know a bloke  who is into long casting, & most of the blokes around the world, that do that, use boca bearings, cheers Don.

Quote from: Donnyboat on August 31, 2024, 02:37:44 AMI know a bloke  who is into long casting, & most of the blokes around the world, that do that, use boca bearings, cheers Don.

Interestingly enough, I did a spin test between Boca Lightning SMR115C-YZZ and NMB DDL-1150ZZ Y04.  The Bocas did spin better when run dry, but when I applied some ISO 10 oil, they were about the same.  I initially tested this with an Abu 2500C with zero braking and empty spool.  I also tested with a single brake block and the line guide made 3 full trips back and forth with both types of bearings.  This tells me that we are always at the mercy of our thumb and the braking system.

I got Roro ceramic bearings in my Black Max 3 BFS.They did 52 seconds
on the pencil spin test.It dont put fish on the table & probably catches more fisherman than anything- like benchmarks for a PC,bragging rights   Roro are smooth though

Quote from: jgp12000 on August 31, 2024, 11:55:06 AMI got Roro ceramic bearings in my Black Max 3 BFS.They did 52 seconds
on the pencil spin test.It dont put fish on the table & probably catches more fisherman than anything- like benchmarks for a PC,bragging rights   Roro are smooth though

I wish I could get that kind of spin from a Roro.  The ones I have will spin about 10 to 15 seconds lol.  That's run dry as well.

for spool bearings to get maximum spin, i do the following.  first, i pop open one of the shields.  then i load it with corrosion x or any medium weight oil.  i take compressed air and blow out all of the oil and any grease that may be hiding inside.  i repeat the oil and compressed air until it spins like crazy.  then i hit it with carb cleaner and a little more compressed air.  the final step is a dip into TSI 321.  all of this is with plain stainless steel bearings.  i never use ceramics. 

this has given me the best results over the years.   

I do mine a similar way.  I soak in mineral spirits to loosen and gunk, then shoot them with brake cleaner.  I was using CRC electronics cleaner but it's now $10-$11 per can instead of $3.  Bums me out, that stuff was great.

I use a few drops of lucas reel oil on my bearings.