Help Id a penn reel , "Old Penn reel with aftermarket backlash adjustment"

[Bill B]

Fred I think this is a good candidate for a tutorial style thread....I know it's a lot of work, but as unique as this is, it would e nice to document this for all to see.   Bill

[foakes]

Joe --

Since I am not a collector (gave that up years ago, after handling a few estate liquidations -- realized how quickly relatives, sons, daughters and wives would get rid of massive amounts of reels, parts, and gear -- that took maybe 40 or 50 years to amass -- for pennies on the dollar.  Our "precious things" are just excess to be rid of for most folks) -- I am not sure how soon this would be a priority for me to get into.

So I just pulled off the parts you need, took some pics -- hoping this may help you a bit.

Surprisingly, this is not some hack or Rube Goldberg attempt.  It has been crafted by someone, perhaps a machinist or watchmaker, or reel company employee -- with a lot of experience and simple cleverness.

Notice the (4) raised dimples to grab and tighten the mechanism -- the reversed inward teeth on the ratchet, slightly rounded at the corners -- the exact angle necessary for the slider/locker to interact with the ratchet wheel -- all exactly what is needed -- no more, no less -- a minimum of simplicity, form, and function.

And how many folks could install that spring with a tiny hollow rivet -- and make it smooth, tight, and effective after 65 years?

The thin nylon, or some other type of material spacer washer that goes between the ratchet and the top washer under the locking nut -- just broke in half as I was holding it.  So I am substituting a copper shim to see how that would work.  Should do better than the original, I suspect.

Hope this helps -- glad to help with anything else, if possible.

Best,

Fred

[foakes]

All back together so the parts don't get lost.

Best,

Fred

[Alto Mare]

That's too bad, I was hoping to see a little more
Is that spring coiled in the gear? also, is the tension really soft?
I'm trying to figure out how it works, it has to disengage at soime point or the line would snap.

Very nice reel Fred, thanks for waking up early this morning to share it with us .
You are full of surprises, and good ones.

Sal

[foakes]

The spring has really light tension, Sal --

However, as you rotate the ratchet wheel forward -- the tension increases until you have it dialed in to where you need it for the fishing conditions (surf, weight of sinkers, line test, etc.).

Then you use the thumb screw to lock the slide tab in place.

The spring is fastened to the sideplate with a tiny brass machine screw -- through a loop in the tail of the spring.  Top side of the spring is riveted to the ratchet wheel with the tiniest hollow rivet I hope to never see again.

All it is -- is a line sensor to immediately activate the spool brake when the wire senses that the line has gone slack due to the sinker hitting bottom.

If you had it on your bench -- you would have it figured out immediately -- would also respect the design -- but would likely offer at least 5 good improvements.  

You just can't help yourself -- you are a Master Engineer!

Wish there were more of these around, so we could get other viewpoints and opinions.

Best,

Fred

[oldmanjoe]

 Fred I can not thank you enough  !!!!    The pictures are totally different  than what imagine ,thinking that the star had the two flats.
Ware as the picture shows that it is a clean hole  . the dimpled washer has the flats.  Also 4 dimples only giving you 1/4 turn adjustments .

I was thinking that the star had the flats and that the thumb screw was going to be able to drop in any one of the notches , giving you multiple adjustments.   Again i thank you !!!!    I am going to study the pictures more closely and see what i can do.    A  watch maker i  am not, but i am still going to try...    joe

[oldmanjoe]

    point to ponder..... How hard is it going to to cast this reel ,when your mind is going to tell your thumb to be the brake man...joe

[Alto Mare]

Thanks for the detailed explanation Fred, very much appreciated.
No Master Engineer here, just a guy that like to take chances at times.
Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose, but if you don't take chances, you will definitely lose .

Thanks again Fred.

Sal

[foakes]

  point to ponder..... How hard is it going to to cast this reel ,when your mind is going to tell your thumb to be the brake man...joe

I would suspect you just cast it normally -- starting out by thumbing the spool -- then letting your thumb off the spool immediately.

Then the line sensor will be in the forward position because of the weighted bait peeling off the front of the reel.

As soon as the sinker hits bottom the line goes slightly slack -- and the spring loaded bar moves back to the upward position -- thus stopping the spool, and preventing line overruns and birdnests.

With the amount of thought that went into this mechanism -- I would expect it to work well.

Maybe tomorrow I'll mount it on a rod -- and go do a little dry meadow casting to give you guys a report.

Might catch a Douglas Grey Squirrel.

Best,

Fred

[oc1]

The part that may take getting used to is after the cast when you move your left hand up to the fore grip.  Remember to grab the line as you reposition your left hand because I think the wire will hold it too high to reach it with your thumb and index finger when the fore grip is in your palm.  With fore grip in the palm you need to get control of line with thumb and index finger to apply tension and level lay it.
-steve

[oldmanjoe]

   As i sit here trying to wrap my head around this , cutting up light card board for a template and trying to get the ark right for the bale.   when the brake is on just the bottom bale is resting on the stop ?        The upper part of the bar will be about 3 o`clock at this point?      Or is it 4 o`clock?    Meaning the top part of the bar sits on the side plates and the rear bar is not ?    Also i am guessing that the spread between the bars is about 200-250 thousands ?           Every picture thus far the brake is not on !!           please,please  , Fred can i get a picture and a measurement.   I truly appreciate your time and patience , thanks again joe 

[Rancanfish]

Fred, don't go too nuts casting that reel, it may get squirrely.  Sorry. 

[foakes]

This may help a bit, Joe --

Wire bail forward is free-spool

Wire back and up is spool brake activation

Spring tension likely has to do with fishing conditions, line size, weight of casted baits, and personal preference.

Vest,

Fred

[oldmanjoe]

  Thank you Fred  that helped a lot .    If i am seeing this rite ,the bale can pass over the 'stop bar' ?    joe

[foakes]

Right, just what you see, Joe --

I will know perhaps more with actual field trials -- was going to do it today -- but it is dark, cold, and drizzling outside. 

So likely tomorrow to test and maybe hook a few Meadow Mullets.

Don't have a go-pro, and do not know how to post a video anyway -- but will take a few snapshots and offer any explanation that might be useful.

Best,

Fred