113h/114h senator - short version

[Gaujo]

I caught all of my cows on Avet and Penn 50s, it was for referance on drag.  The reel is a very early Avet EX50 STS, the first one that Charkbait got.  We stopped at Mark's shop to say hi and he convinced me my 30's were not big enough, I'm sure glad he did.

As for being tough, no brain no pain.  My wife chewed me bad for going elk hunting 2 weeks after being let out of the hospital, and 20 days after having 1/3 of my colon removed along with a grapefruit size tumor.  I made it over the ridge and into where we hunt but only one day and the rest of the time was spent in and close to camp.  I think it helped me recover faster to keep going.

That's a cool story.  A lot of outdoorsmen seem to recover from illness best in the outdoors.  I was watching "The National Parks: America's Greatest Idea" last night, and John Muir was like that.

[Gaujo]

I'll sell you a beater penn international 50 for $150 shipped, if you want a good starting platform for 40lb of drag.

[johndtuttle]

Question for teh Gurus:

On my 113H I get a "buzz" transmitted through the handle from something inside when the handle rotates from 9 to 12. This buzz increases as I crank down the drag.

I double and tripled checked the drag washers, everything is in order and stacking properly. I looked at the bearings and there were no external signs of rust pulled them out and reset them in their little cubbies....I visually inspected the pinion and main and there is no apparent damage...and it always recurs through the same arc of rotation (from 9-12).

Seems to be coming from the right side...as near as I can tell.

Is this simply frame flex causing the gears to mis-align?

Other?

thx for all replies...

[redsetta]

G'day John,
Hard to say at this stage, but we can discount the main gear as it only goes around once for every 3.25 rotations of the spool.
We can also discount the pinion as it's likewise rotating 3.25 times with each full handle/main gear revolution.
The spool must be touching something at the same point on each rotation.
Are the any burrs etc on the spool edge?
Also, try watching the gap between the spool and the inner ring - if the gap opens and closes very slightly, the spool shaft may not be true.
Hope that's of some assistance.
Good luck, Justin

[johndtuttle]

Thx very much for the reply.

Sorry to not be more clear but it is with every complete rotation of the *handle* from 9-12 not the spool.

In which case, it would be something in the gear train as the bearings, spool, spindle etc would be going around 3.3 times per handle turn I would think....

thanks again for spending your time thinking about this.

best

ps. It was like this before I just replaced the gear sleeve too, but when I replaced the sleeve I played with maybe putting a washer underneath it to reduce play but could not find one thin enough. The one I tried was completely flush so the spindle for the gear shaft seems to be true to rule that out...

[redsetta]

Sorry John - completely misinterpreted that.

[broadway]

John,
       Check Justin's first thought... the main gear or pinion for tooth damage.
The buzz sound isn't typical, but the exact same spot on every crank of the handle sounds familiar.
Let us know how ya make out,
Dom

[johndtuttle]

John,
       Check Justin's first thought... the main gear or pinion for tooth damage.
The buzz sound isn't typical, but the exact same spot on every crank of the handle sounds familiar.
Let us know how ya make out,
Dom

Nothing seen.

To be clear, it is not a "sound" as it is a feeling of "buzz" through the handle. Possibly I've just become more accustomed to machined bodies and SS gears in other reels and closer tolerances...

Still scratching my head...

Thx for all replies.

[Alto Mare]

It could be a few things. Did you place the gears in the reel or were they already in?  Are the gears ss? Is the reel new?
Start from here: Set the reel in freespool, tighten the left bearing all the way and back it up just enough so the spool spinns. Turn the music off , give the spool a spinn and listen closly for any intermitted sounds. If freespool is smooth, the easiest way to check the gears is to swap them with another set and see if the problem still exists. I'm leaning towards the gears not meshing properly, coulkd also be the bearings . If you have ss gears, this would be normal, they will get quieter with usage.
The first step mentioned above will let you know if the spool shaft is slightly bent or if the frame is out of square.
good luck, Sal

[johndtuttle]

Thanks for that Sal,

Checked the free spool and it's fine.

I'm thinking I have to take the time to pull the bearings and look inside and put that to rest. These reels are so easy to take down I have no excuse not to. Last time I did not pull the shields and only rotated them by hand and they seemed smooth. But with a little more torque from the handle pressure they could be the source of the small vibration I feel in the handle when it's cranked over.

best regards

[Joel.B]

I have a few questions about stainless 4:1 gears -

I have various fine-grit lapping compounds I use for rifles-  would it be OK/Beneficial to lap the gears to make them smoother and quieter? I was thinking of smearing them with the compound- setting them up on an old 113h and just cranking away while I watch my soaps......

Is one make of gears better than others? Newell Accurate....?

If I could get a guy to make a run of new gears- how many do you suppose he could get buyers for within 6 months? What could he charge? I see used sets selling for $75 -$100+......that is just so crazy.

[Bryan Young]

If you can get gears similar to accurates, hardened stainless steel for around $50, I'm sure you would sell a 100 fast.  After that, it will probably slow down.

[broadway]

I haven't been keeping you guys posted, but I am working on the gears.
Let ya know when I get the manufacturers final word.
Dom

[saltydog]

Do tell.

[broadway]

Salty,
    I will keep you guys informed when I know more,  but I can't believe what a process this is.  I guess, get it done once and the rest will follow.
Thanks,
Dom