Setting Drag To Another Level-Torque Method

[Alto Mare]

Matt, it's great to see you being so involved into this, your hard work is appreciated. I  believe that the most accurate way of determinig line retrieve per crank is on a DRY full spool.  As soon as that line hits the water, all of the statistics go with it. Just my opinion. Different story if a reel was made like a belt pulley . Sal

[BassMatt]

Sal, I hear you, and it's just like I have said before.

"All this logic is great and fun to use as a guide and to think about and talk about, but nothing replaces the experience gained from practical use over time"

The main thing I'm interested in all this is to develop a pattern. I think all of us are serious enough about finding the pattern when fishing in general. The only thing that matters more beyond that is to duplicate on another spot what you did ounce you think you have found a pattern. Thats why I created the Torque Method. I have found a way to adjust my drag to the right setting or benchmark that works with my type of fishing, so it's easier for me to predict what to expect out of my reels.

Trying to understand what fish will do is a lot like understanding what women will do...its complicated. But if you develop a pattern, then you can predict how to handle the situation better.
All this stuff doesn't mean that it will yield the perfect results, and that's not what I'm after.  I'm after the trend and to understand and predict better what happens when fish bite. And they will not be their long most of the time, so you have to be prepared.

You have to start somewhere. I would rather not do it by trial and error not knowing anything in particular and lose 10 world trophy fish. Instead, I try to use everything I know to work towards being a better angler and being better prepared, and maybe I'll only lose 2 trophy fish instead in the process.

Killerbug

I think your method would find use for lab testing drags, but a better connection between the torque wrench and the reels are needed. But with little effort this can be easily be made I guess.

No doubt all reels are not set up or designed the same, nor have a regular nut on the end. Some have covers; some have a nut retaining rings that is bolted on the handle, (which helps with my method). Care should be considered when using or selecting your weights. When the manufacture mills the handle shaft for the handle slot, the industry torque guidelines are lost by the modification.

With my reels it's very easy because the nut is exposed like many others. On some of my older reels that had covers, I bought just a regular acorn reel handle nut that fit the threads, omitted the cover, and used that as my connection point, and it still looks good. I have also experienced that using a regular torque wrench is not ideal, but would work. The torque driver that looks like a hand held nut driver is the best; it's easy to handle, small, and fits my small reel toolbox (pelican case) or tackle bag.

MM

[treidm]

Matt:

I think the in-depth method you have for measuring spool to calculate line capacity has been well thought out.

I have given it much thought and tried a very simple method and tested it against yours as you asked.
I realized my mistakes were being made in differing types of measurements, so I spent two nights thinking and working on this.
I wanted to have a method where all the measurements were not necessary, and you would just need to know one time a line diameter & spool capacity, and that's all. Here's the comparison....

YOUR METHOD
Your Given Parameters
Full Spool Diameter Metric = 28mm
Empty Spool Diameter Metric = 16mm
Average Spool Width Metric = 20mm
CONVERTED TO STANDARD
Full Spool Diameter Inches = 1.1023622047
Empty Spool Diameter Inches = 0.6299212598
Average Spool Width Inches = 0.7874015748

YOUR EXCEL FORMULA GIVEN
=(( Average Spool Width Inches/((COS(RADIANS(30)))*2* Line Diameter Inches))*((3.14* Line Diameter Inches *((POWER(Full Spool Diameter Inches,2))-(POWER(Empty Spool Diameter Inches,2)))/(4*(POWER(Line Diameter Inches,2)))))/12)/3

Plugged in various line diameters:
0.006 = 225.355
0.008 = 126.762 (This was the one you said was known @ 125yd) Your pretty close
0.010 = 81.128
0.011 = 67.048
0.012 = 56.339
0.014 = 41.392
0.018 = 25.039
0.022 = 16.762
__________________________________________________

NEW SIMPLIFIED METHOD (NO MEASURING OF SPOOLS)
Using your 0.008 & 126.762 as known capacity
Results
0.006 = 225.3547
0.008 = 126.762
0.010 = 81.1277
0.011 = 67.0477
0.012 = 56.3387
0.014 = 41.3917
0.018 = 25.0394
0.022 = 16.7619

The formula needs all parameters to be the same type to work, so if you are using standard, all must be in inches, if using metric, all must be in millimeters.

I've made an EXCEL sheet that has both Standard & Metric Calculators, along with included mini-calculators for inch to mm, yard to meter, mm to inch & meter to yard conversions.

So once you have a known capacity for a known line diameter, this should work without measuring the spool

It's been fun to think on this.....

If anyone wants a copy, shoot a pm, I'll email you one to try

Think I'll try and make one for backing & topshots next

Reid

[redsetta]

Wow, great thread lads.
My head hurts. 

[mickrazz]

All this for a Revo STX drag?? You guys are nuts.

[wallacewt]

yo

[willybendit]

well after reading each and every page my head is about to blow up over in England we are miles behind you lads as regards checking our reel drags  most of the lads i fish with just pull on the line and if it feels good you ready to go  i tryed to explane to them about using to 1/3 of your main line  IE 30lbs set your drag @ 10lbs  then i started to play with the scales and greased drag washers  well ive fitted most of the lads reels with carbon X washers & Cal`s  and set there drags up and boy  what a differance im now at the stage where i need to upgrade my scales from not having a tell tail to a set of scales that does so i can set my drags up on my own  i was watching some big game fishing in aussie on you tube and i noticed a chap call peter kulma using drag scale  wow that looks the business so a got in touch with him through email his reply was it was a BOUZ Drag Checker  that you can check your drag just in front of the reel or you can check after threading through the guides /rollers  now what a great idea  only thing is thare are not available over hear in England  so check them out on google   now who would like to buy me a scale and send it over to England other wise i have to pay import tax and vat and postage and that would make the drag checker way over price round about £120 sterling  there is two models in the range im after the DC -1015  the red one i can pay by pay-pal   regards & tight-lines Alain

[wallacewt]

i can look into it for you willy if you like.

[willybendit]

Hi Wallacewt  that would be great  i do know you can buy them in aus  have you herd of peter Kuluma   (Kuluma tackle) big game charter skipper  ill check on google see what shops come up  speak soon tight-lines Alain

[wallacewt]

price on their site is $225aud without postage to uk.i sent them an email and will let you know soon

[wallacewt]

do you mean peter pakula,(peter kuluma?)
good fisherman and very smart

[willybendit]

Hi Wallacewt  thats him   he as some good clips on you tube

[wallacewt]

got the email back from drag checker.
$225aud and firm
free shipping in aust;
international is xtra

[willybendit]

Hi wallacewt    just checked the price  from aud $  to  £ sterling  works out at  £140 + post ?  the F. P. O = fishing. Permision . Officer = the wife would go nuts if i bought one   best to leave it of the shops shelf  thanks anyway for your help tight-lines Alain

[JGB]

Try this out. It is the link to Plate in Japan. The Bouz runs around $55 USD there.
http://www.plat.co.jp/shop/catalog/product_info/language/en/manufacturers_id/54/products_id/2320/bouz/drag-checker-1005.html

Also they have the Seagaur Kuhrea 130 Flouro on sale.  Great prices on this line. Tested it out on the bench and diameter and strength equal to Blackwate Shock and Seagaur Premier.
http://www.plat.co.jp/shop/catalog/default/language/en/cPath/30_415_1078/fishing-line/shock-leader-leader-etc/kureha-fluorocarbon/

JimN.